Who has highports? - Vintage Mustang Forums

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post #1 of 15 (permalink) Old 09-21-2016, 11:25 AM Thread Starter
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Who has highports?

I'm looking at getting a set of 225 highports from Sam Vincent, but I'm afraid that's going to leave me with having to get rid of the shock towers. I'd really like to do the AJE strut kit, and put a rack in the car, which would fix the issue, but honestly it's something I'd rather do down the road so I won't miss another season of racing. I know there are a few guys that run highports and use a stepped header. Is that for fitment around the Z bar, or are there other areas of interference? I run a auto, and I'm curious if my hooker 6208s will work with those heads?
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post #2 of 15 (permalink) Old 09-22-2016, 06:15 PM
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i have high ports. i have 1 5/8 to 1 3/4 stepped headers. the first step is short and where they run by the shock towers is 1 3/4". i only ran 1 5/8" out of the port because of the standard bolt pattern on mine and FPA's claim 1 3/4" wasn't possible with that. removing the shock towers wouldn't make any improvement on mine.
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post #3 of 15 (permalink) Old 09-23-2016, 05:57 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sportsroof69 View Post
I'm looking at getting a set of 225 highports from Sam Vincent, but I'm afraid that's going to leave me with having to get rid of the shock towers. I'd really like to do the AJE strut kit, and put a rack in the car, which would fix the issue, but honestly it's something I'd rather do down the road so I won't miss another season of racing. I know there are a few guys that run highports and use a stepped header. Is that for fitment around the Z bar, or are there other areas of interference? I run a auto, and I'm curious if my hooker 6208s will work with those heads?
I think Dennis112 had seriously looked into running those and is always a wealth of knowledge. The 6208 flange ports are actually quite small. They are even restricting my vic jr ports so I can only imagine they would be even worse on a bigger head. I would think you would want bigger primary pipes on those heads anyway.


68 J code sprint, 408W
11.47@123.35mph in street trim.
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post #4 of 15 (permalink) Old 09-23-2016, 07:28 AM Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by buckeyedemon View Post
i have high ports. i have 1 5/8 to 1 3/4 stepped headers. the first step is short and where they run by the shock towers is 1 3/4". i only ran 1 5/8" out of the port because of the standard bolt pattern on mine and FPA's claim 1 3/4" wasn't possible with that. removing the shock towers wouldn't make any improvement on mine.
Thanks for the info. I sent an email to FPA two days ago, but haven't heard back
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Originally Posted by frdnut View Post
I think Dennis112 had seriously looked into running those and is always a wealth of knowledge. The 6208 flange ports are actually quite small. They are even restricting my vic jr ports so I can only imagine they would be even worse on a bigger head. I would think you would want bigger primary pipes on those heads anyway.
Yeah, I really need to get rid of the 6208s for what I'm doing, along with the shock towers, but I'm having a hard time coming accepting what's about to happen to my car, and how much money it's going to cost. Lol

And honestly, the worst part is I'm going to have to put a cowl hood on the car, and I HATE that.
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post #5 of 15 (permalink) Old 09-24-2016, 05:51 AM
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You might be able to get away with notching the towers. I like cowl hoods but love the stockish look as well.


68 J code sprint, 408W
11.47@123.35mph in street trim.
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post #6 of 15 (permalink) Old 09-24-2016, 09:02 AM Thread Starter
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I really need to do something with the front end of the car anyways. It's sketchy. If I go the highports route, I'm really going to want a 2" primary, so losing the shock towers will make my life easier in the long run, and make the car better. FPA never emailed me back, so they're out the running for headers anyways.
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post #7 of 15 (permalink) Old 09-24-2016, 10:03 AM
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I was going to do the 240 high ports but after conferring with big bore Ford small block guru Duane Busch he said that the 7721 Edelbrock Victor race head would work much better to reach my 93 octane pump gas NA 9 second goal. He said that the 240 high ports would have left a lot of HP on the table and it may not get my heavy street/street turd there.

New 7721 castings were hand ported, flowed, and assembled by DB with stainless steel valves were cheaper than a pair of highports from TEA. Definitely a lot cheaper than major porting places on the net advertise.

Mine were ported for my NA needs with 381cfm int/271 cfm ex @ 7000 rpm. Intake and exhaust ports are both raised on the 7721 head--.380" intake and .520" exhaust. My heads are far from maxed out and can further ported with larger than the 2.150" intake valves that I have. Ports can be made huge if needed. This is a head that can grow with your needs.

The 7721 uses any standard Edelbrock intake (which should be flowed to the heads.) I use the 2924 Super Vic but a 2828 is more performance oriented. 7721's should be run with shaft rockers so that is an additional expense--but necessary for higher RPM's. Also they use an oddball 2.5" header flange. Not hard to find but not that common either.

The best thing about using DB is that he not only did he do the heads, he had a hand in spec'ing the cam, compression, carb and exhaust size. Even the rear gear. He still checks in on me and suggests changes I can do to my car. Although I have been slow to follow through with all of his suggestions, I ran a 10.004 just last week in the heat/humidity with my small tire car.

The only place that I could find off the shelf big tube headers that were larger than 1 3/4" for a Windsor in a stock suspension Mustang was Accufab. (Remember that I installed the 68' shock towers/suspension in my car a couple of years ago.) Accufab offers both 1 7/8" and 2" headers with a choice of flanges and collector sizes. Both diameter headers are semi-designed to sort of fit the 67+ engine compartments but definitely expect that you will need to reroute some tubes to get them to fit with out interference with the towers. I bought the 1 7/8" tubes with 3.5" collectors as that was what was spec'ed by DB. Notching the 68' towers probably wouldn't have been needed but I went that way for more access to the plugs and things--as far as tube rerouting there isn't much to gain at the towers since the exhaust flanges are almost at the LCA bolting location. I am still not 100$ atisfied with the Accufab headers and plan on rerouting some tubes to raise the collectors higher over the winter. They are OK height for a drag car but not for my street/strip car.

My suggestion is to figure out how you want the front suspension to be and go that route with the motor/headers from the get go. Doing things twice leads to added expense. Band aids won't be cheap and neither will replacement part if they are already on the verge of being marginal. Thanks to the Fox body platform, there are lots of bit tube headers for R&P cars so that might be your best route BUT as you probably have noticed, its an expensive route to take. What you have can be made to work with minimal expense (except for the headers.)

There is an internet forum poster named jasonn (yes 2 n's) who runs a stock type front suspension 70' mustang with a mild 427w motor (10.81 compression), 240 high ports, big FTI SR cam, 2924 intake, 2" tube Accufab headers, and he recently ran 8.87@152.9 with a 350 shot. Perhaps you might hunt him down to pic his brain.
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65' Stang Street/Strip:



Dart 434W NA, G101A 4 Spd, 4:56 rear, 93 octane pump gas pushing 3550lbs. 9.82@138.00
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post #8 of 15 (permalink) Old 09-24-2016, 12:53 PM
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Would a tear drop hood help?
It's more "Ford" than a cowl hood.
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post #9 of 15 (permalink) Old 09-26-2016, 09:14 AM Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dennis111 View Post
I was going to do the 240 high ports but after conferring with big bore Ford small block guru Duane Busch he said that the 7721 Edelbrock Victor race head would work much better to reach my 93 octane pump gas NA 9 second goal. He said that the 240 high ports would have left a lot of HP on the table and it may not get my heavy street/street turd there.

New 7721 castings were hand ported, flowed, and assembled by DB with stainless steel valves were cheaper than a pair of highports from TEA. Definitely a lot cheaper than major porting places on the net advertise.

Mine were ported for my NA needs with 381cfm int/271 cfm ex @ 7000 rpm. Intake and exhaust ports are both raised on the 7721 head--.380" intake and .520" exhaust. My heads are far from maxed out and can further ported with larger than the 2.150" intake valves that I have. Ports can be made huge if needed. This is a head that can grow with your needs.

The 7721 uses any standard Edelbrock intake (which should be flowed to the heads.) I use the 2924 Super Vic but a 2828 is more performance oriented. 7721's should be run with shaft rockers so that is an additional expense--but necessary for higher RPM's. Also they use an oddball 2.5" header flange. Not hard to find but not that common either.

The best thing about using DB is that he not only did he do the heads, he had a hand in spec'ing the cam, compression, carb and exhaust size. Even the rear gear. He still checks in on me and suggests changes I can do to my car. Although I have been slow to follow through with all of his suggestions, I ran a 10.004 just last week in the heat/humidity with my small tire car.

The only place that I could find off the shelf big tube headers that were larger than 1 3/4" for a Windsor in a stock suspension Mustang was Accufab. (Remember that I installed the 68' shock towers/suspension in my car a couple of years ago.) Accufab offers both 1 7/8" and 2" headers with a choice of flanges and collector sizes. Both diameter headers are semi-designed to sort of fit the 67+ engine compartments but definitely expect that you will need to reroute some tubes to get them to fit with out interference with the towers. I bought the 1 7/8" tubes with 3.5" collectors as that was what was spec'ed by DB. Notching the 68' towers probably wouldn't have been needed but I went that way for more access to the plugs and things--as far as tube rerouting there isn't much to gain at the towers since the exhaust flanges are almost at the LCA bolting location. I am still not 100$ atisfied with the Accufab headers and plan on rerouting some tubes to raise the collectors higher over the winter. They are OK height for a drag car but not for my street/strip car.

My suggestion is to figure out how you want the front suspension to be and go that route with the motor/headers from the get go. Doing things twice leads to added expense. Band aids won't be cheap and neither will replacement part if they are already on the verge of being marginal. Thanks to the Fox body platform, there are lots of bit tube headers for R&P cars so that might be your best route BUT as you probably have noticed, its an expensive route to take. What you have can be made to work with minimal expense (except for the headers.)

There is an internet forum poster named jasonn (yes 2 n's) who runs a stock type front suspension 70' mustang with a mild 427w motor (10.81 compression), 240 high ports, big FTI SR cam, 2924 intake, 2" tube Accufab headers, and he recently ran 8.87@152.9 with a 350 shot. Perhaps you might hunt him down to pic his brain.
That's great that DB has been a great help to you. I've never heard anything but good from him.

I also have a SBF guru steering me in this build, in Sam Vincent. He's the one steering me to the highports, and will also be spec'ing my cam, and such. I'm not doing anything twice, which is why I haven't bought the AJE stuff yet. I think I can do the AJE and be in the whole thing for ~$3K, and not only would it make headers easier, but I'd have R&P, and a huge selection of struts for the front, along with making the car a million times easier to work on. Being a part time nitrous car, the plugs get pulled a lot, and I'm tired of taking off valve covers to pull plugs.

I still think the goals of what I want the car to do, could be done with my heads. I told Sam I want to drive the car a lot on the street, run on pump gas, hyd cam, and run 6.50 on motor, and be able to spray it. I typically run a 7.0 index, so that's why the car really needs to run a 6.50 on motor, and I spray it for fun, and also for a few other various races throughout the year. The car ran a best of 6.92 (on motor) previously, so we are going to need about another 100 horsepower. I had TW185s on it, and I was considering sending them to somone like TEA for their largest CNC program, which includes larger valves, and they'd come back flowing 330@.600, and add a super Vic, with a updated cam, and I'd be close to where I want to be. I'm also putting fuel injection on it, maybe FAST XFI, but I haven't decided for sure yet which kit I'm going with. I really think I could get close to my goal with that combination, but Sam says no, and to sell those heads and buy highports. I actually called TEA last week to run it by them, and they told me the same thing, so now I'm leaning towards that route.

Quote:
Originally Posted by 11thAirborne View Post
Would a tear drop hood help?
It's more "Ford" than a cowl hood.
Eh..... I think that would look odd on a Mustang.
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post #10 of 15 (permalink) Old 09-26-2016, 07:15 PM
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Assuming that your car is similar to mine at 3550lbs race weight it will take at least 650hp to run 6.50 NA. I agree that the TW's aren't going to get you there and the 240 high port stands a better chance.

I've gone 6.37NA (although my car is geared for the 1/4 mile.) It sees street duty too and its amazing how tame it is when the full exhaust is installed.

Good Luck

Dennis

65' Stang Street/Strip:



Dart 434W NA, G101A 4 Spd, 4:56 rear, 93 octane pump gas pushing 3550lbs. 9.82@138.00
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post #11 of 15 (permalink) Old 09-26-2016, 07:40 PM Thread Starter
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That seems heavy for your car, but you probably have more cage than me. My race weight was 3380 lbs, and I'm figuring between 3450-3500 with the new setup. I still have all the interior, and the heavy stock seats. Like I said, to go from 6.90 to 6.50 is about 100 horsepower. It went 6.30s with a 55 jet before, which is maybe 125 on my kit. Probably not even that, but that makes the converter a lot happier too. I still think going from a 185 to the outlaw port would get me there. The engine is going to make more power just by going from a stock block, to a Dart alone, and that's not even factoring the added displacement.

Last edited by sportsroof69; 09-26-2016 at 07:45 PM.
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post #12 of 15 (permalink) Old 04-11-2017, 05:32 PM
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I'm currently installing AJE kit in my 67, and I noticed the towers back. I'm going to be building a 427 w/TEA 225 highports. I'm hoping to run fox highport headers and not have to modify anything, but we shall see.
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post #13 of 15 (permalink) Old 04-11-2017, 11:40 PM
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Just for those using search: After waiting for my Accufabs to install my 225hp 427W they were too far off to install in my restored engine bay and even though built specifically for the Borgeson PS box.....I don't know they'll ever fit that box/installation.

Ended up installing some P38's in the car and had NO clearance issues with them and OTS JBA 1.75" headers.

Hopefully with the next build, I'll get a chance to attempt the Accufabs before engine bay restored as it'll take some modifications of one or both to make it really work on the highports on 351 deck block.

69 351 TKO Sport Roof, Ride Tech coilover
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post #14 of 15 (permalink) Old 04-13-2017, 03:18 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lukesportsman View Post
Just for those using search: After waiting for my Accufabs to install my 225hp 427W they were too far off to install in my restored engine bay and even though built specifically for the Borgeson PS box.....I don't know they'll ever fit that box/installation.

Ended up installing some P38's in the car and had NO clearance issues with them and OTS JBA 1.75" headers.

Hopefully with the next build, I'll get a chance to attempt the Accufabs before engine bay restored as it'll take some modifications of one or both to make it really work on the highports on 351 deck block.
Any pics of of teh accufab test fitting with 225HP? Thats the setup I'm looking to go with, but using AJE front suspension with trimmed towers.
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post #15 of 15 (permalink) Old 05-16-2017, 11:34 PM
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cowl hood= chevy

maybe a big boss 429 scoop? anything but a chevy hood.
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