new member with t5 questions

[n8rfastback]

hi guys, i better start by introducing myself. my name is nate and im in omaha nebraska, i bought a 65fastback back in 02 or 03 and spent my junior and senior year of high school working on it with my dad. and now its time again for some upgrades. right now the car has:

65 fastback, 289
stock drums all the way around, manual brakes
no power steering
stock rear end
c4 auto, that shifts like crap and is really clunky


i want to go with power steering, power brakes, discs up front, a t5 and a posi with 3.50 or so gears in the rear.

im selling my old bike (78 suzuki gs1000) and will have about 1800 this spring to do some mods. i think i wanna get the big stuff out of the way first, so i was looking into the t5 swap.

wheres the best place to get a t5? ive checked around the parts yards here and couldnt find anything, and i dont mind buying a rebuilt one or one from ford racing if i need to. but i would rather go a cheaper route if possible.

is there a comprehensive list of parts for the swap? any advice? where do i get the driveshaft shortened? whats the average cost for that?

thanks for any help guys,

-nate

[ISLANDER]

Welcome,you will need alot of stuff . I am not a fan of putting used parts in unless absolutely necessary. the best route would be to go with someone like modern driveline and get the complete kit, Bruce will steer you straight and his kits are complete bolt in.

[1109RWHP]

Contact www.hanlonmotorsports.com Bob has been building them for years.

[caveeagle]

That is a nice looking fastback, and suzuki. I used to ride an '81 GS750.

Going from your auto to a manual is a fun swap. How much to you care about originality etc? You could go crazy tracking down all to parts for an original clutch linkage setup. Have you checked out the 'mustangsteve' and the 'ultrastang' websites? I really like how they both approach upgrades. MustangSteve has a pretty good option to get you into a cable clutch for your T5 assuming you are going with the late model bell housing. If you are using an early bell, then you will probably need to go with a z-bar and original style linkage.

A lot depends on your budget and other limitations.

For your differential, I would stick with your 8" and just by a rebuilt 3rd member with a track-lok and your favorite gears. To match your T5, you will most likely be happy with a set of 3.55 gears. That depends on how radical your engine is and which model of T5 you end up with. Most T5 will have a 3.35:1 first gear. I think the T5z trannys have a 2.97, so make sure you know what you are getting. This is very important If you mix a 3.35 first gear with a 3.80 differential, your first gear will become nearly useless. I would check ebay for a rebuilt 8" 3rd member. ~$650 should get you there.

Some cars may not need the driveshaft shortened. If you need that, Most decent size towns have someone that does driveshaft service & repair. I just had one made for about $175 in steele.

You have a ton of options for brakes. I won't even go there until you give up a little more info on what you are shooting for.

[n8rfastback]

well i want the car to be fun, its gonna be a street car, very little to no track time.

i was thinking of stock discs and power steering setup.

the car was originally a straight 6, but converted later to 289 and 5 lugs. i had it painted shelby spec, so im not worried about originality.

[n8rfastback]

i would like to go with a hydraulic clutch, i have tri y headers on and i heard of issues with cable clutches and headers.

[n8rfastback]

i would like to stick around 2k for the conversion, then later on have the rear end done and other upgrades finished. i was thinking of doing the t5 first, since it will be the most expensive upgrade most likely

[66Restomod]

Originally Posted by n8rfastback

i would like to go with a hydraulic clutch, i have tri y headers on and i heard of issues with cable clutches and headers.

I put my hydraulic clutch for around 220 and it is great, I put together some info on what I learned on my website as well as part suppliers and model numbers: Hydraulic clutch

Here is info on how to ID a world class T5 that will handle your torque: How to ID a T5

Here is lots of info I found useful: T5

Do not assume you will need to have your drive shaft shortened until you have the T5 and rearend installed. Then measure. You want to have .750 to 1.000 inches of freeplay. I decided to go aluminum because it will help dampen vibrations. Here is info on my drive shaft measurement and install: Drive shaft

Are you going to use a 10inch 3 finger or 10 1/2inch diaphragm clutch? If you go 10 1/2 you will need a different flywheel to mount the modern clutch to. This wont be to much of an issue since you are going have to buy one anyway. You can buy a new flywheel for 125 on ebay with the correct 28 ounce imbalance, teeth and bolt pattern for a 10 1/2 inch clutch.

Try to use the T5 bellhousing. You wont need to deal with spacers on an old style bellhousing

I am sure you will have more questions. There are lots of options to mix and match and choose from. Figure it all out on which way you are going to go and then buy what you need.

[n8rfastback]

so i guess i need to start by buying a t5. then i can deal with buying what i will need to complete the install.

i would like to go with a 10.5 inch modern clutch if possible. is it a hard conversion? any benefit to staying with the older style 3 finger clutch?

[66Restomod]

Originally Posted by n8rfastback

so i guess i need to start by buying a t5. then i can deal with buying what i will need to complete the install.

i would like to go with a 10.5 inch modern clutch if possible. is it a hard conversion? any benefit to staying with the older style 3 finger clutch?

the diaphragm clutch is smoother and will handle more power. You will spend more time figuring out what you need than actually putting it in.
T5 conversion on a 1-10 scale is a 6. Helps to have an extra set of hands to put it in.

I found mine on Craigslist for $350 and it was out of a 89 5.0 Mustang. Spent another 30 for a steel input shaft and new rear seal and cup.

[Huskinhano]

I wish I was a littler farther along with my 66 in my swap. I originally was dead set against doing a T5 swap and had already bought a good used wide ratio Toploader. Then I got swayed into putting in a T5. So I bought one from a 97 V6 Mustang. The V6 is basically a V8 trans with a 300 ft lb rating, not the 265 pound rating published. I have spoken with several pros including an engineer from Tremec. I went with the V6 since I figured it wouldn't be abused as would one from a 5.0. Plus it was cheaper! Bought a new, shorter input shaft off ebay cheap. Be aware that you have to set the end play and adjust it with shims.

What I don't like about the T5 swap is this. The T5 is not as strong as the Toploader. This may or may not matter in how you intend to use the car for. The T5 is taller, you either have to modify the trans tunnel or the more common and cheaper method of using a T5 swap trans bracket that lowers the rear of the trans to fit in the tunnel. This changes the drive line angle. Some have complained of drive line vibrations since the U joint angles are different. Others have had the top of the air cleaner hit the hood or the fan come very close to the radiator or touch it.

I was going to use a T5 bell housing and convert it to the 65-66 mechanical clutch linkage. What I don't like about this is the fact that you will not be able to get a clutch fork boot to keep road grime out since the opening of the T5 bellhousing is different. Cable linkage wasn't considered either since there can be issues with headers or steering gear if you plan on going to R&P steering BTW, I have a very nice T5 bellhousing and block plate for sale in like new condition!....literally. Since I have the T5 sitting in my basement, down the road if I decide to put the T5 in, I will use an adapter instead of modifying a T5 bellhousing so I can use a clutch fork boot to keep the road grime out.

Since my car is not my daily driver, I've decided to put the Toploader in. I can't agree more with Islander on putting in new parts! No reason to buy or use worn out parts. I had mustangsteve.com rebuild my pedal support with sealed bearing assemblies. You can not imagine how smooth it operates and it's not even in the car! My pedal assembly felt in great shape before but when I pulled it apart, despite feeling nice and tight, was very worn. The cheap pot metal inserts were egg shaped. The clutch pedal rod to the equalizer, I have made up my own. I purchased 2 rod ends from Grainger and a piece of 7/16 rod from a local hardware store along with jamb nuts. This will make every thing work that much smoother.

What I was saying before about wishing I was farther along is that I want to set up allthe parts needed to do a manual swap and post it for all to see who are new to working on cars in general. I'll have to work on that! In the mean time, here's the pedal assembly







BTW, the sealed bearings are very common with the retainer on them. They are for lawn tractors and can be found in a lot of local hardware stores...even Grainger. I have found a very easy way to remove the heavy spring used on the clutch pedal. Remove the retaning clip on the shaft, gently slide the clutch pedal out slightly as though you would remove it. You need to slide it out just enough to clear the bumper and support bracket. While holding the clutch pedal, slowly remove the tension on the spring. I left the stock heavy spring off when I refurbished my pedal assembly and used a much lighter spring I bought at Autozone just to take care of free motion and any slop when things are together.

Oh yeah, one other tid bit is this. the starter for automatics are different then stick shift. Not sure of the exact difference but I think it has to do with the end bell on the starter. I found a new, late model permanent magnet gear reduction 5.0 starter on ebay delivered to my door for $63. The stock starter weighs 16 pounds, this one weighs 7.5 pounds plus it's a lot smaller, more powerful and requires less amperage.

I'm also using a diaphram pressure plate as it requires less pedal pressure. The weather has been conspiring against me at this point

[Huskinhano]

Here's the new linkage I made with 7/16" rod ends I bought at Grainger. This is from the pedal to equalizer bar compared to the factory style rod. I made a bend to follow the stock linkage. I used my 1/2" pipe bender for electrical EMT conduit. Bent easily.

[leefrankpierce]

I purchased an entire doner car.
Specifically an 84 5.0 mustang with a stick.

Actually my motor is shot, so I will be using the entire drive chain, so no matching.
Have not started the move yet, but I don't expect any issues between the motor and trans.

[OCHOHILL]

Originally Posted by n8rfastback

so i guess i need to start by buying a t5. then i can deal with buying what i will need to complete the install.

i would like to go with a 10.5 inch modern clutch if possible. is it a hard conversion? any benefit to staying with the older style 3 finger clutch?

If I may,

I would do the tranny swap only if you can change the rear gears at the same time. A t5 with 2.80 gears would make 5th gear useless.

If you are dyin to spend money now then I would upgrade the front brakes and suspension and stiffen the chassis.

recommended parts:
roller perches $200
620 springs from mustang plus $100
1" shelby drop $25
subframe connectors $150
monte carlo bar $25
export brace $75
front disc brakes $700
new master cylinder $100
new front brake lines $100
rear springs $250
alignment $150

You wouldn't believe it's the same car.

While you are under the car make sure the clunky sound isn't bad u joints.

[n8rfastback]

we replaced and upgraded a bunch of suspension stuff the first time around on the car, monte carlo bar, sub frame connectors, new rear leafs, u joints... all kinds of stuff. and man it did feel like a different car after that!