My previous symptom, when trying to start, was this:
About 9 out of ten times the car would fire up in a split second- I mean instantly, no cranking at all. But...
That other one in ten times when I turned the key all I would get was a short bump.
Not a solenoid or battery click. With the hood up I could see the fan turn a quarter or half turn. It would do this several times then eventually start. Or not... as was the case Saturday afternoon when the starter relay had a literal meltdown.
Does that sound like the "flat spot" you mention? That was the term I was using already.
So, If the recharged battery actually gets it going again I'm still going to have the starter checked out, just for good measure.
Okay, I reinstalled the fully charged battery. I tried to start it. It actually turned over several times like it wanted to start, then nothing. Went back to the split second bump.
I tried a few more times.
I noticed that the "Fuel" in the center 'Convenience Control Panel' stayed On for several seconds after I turned the key off, then I would hear a slight click/pop and the light would go off.
I noticed smoke coming out from what I thought, at first, was the alternator then realized it was actually coming from the battery ground cable about two inches from the block. The cable was hot and the plastic coating was just starting to melt in one tiny spot.
I don't know what else to do.
If the starter is bad, so be it, but why would all this cause the NEG cable to overheat?
What's up with the fuel light glowing? (Maybe it always does that and I never noticed before?)
Sounded like a dead spot in your starter. But there might be a major short now. Or the cable is bad I dont remember if you said you replaced it. I would probably replace the starter,=. If it is screwed up the drain might be so large that it would almost be like a short. That cable may have a bad spot in it causing it to be the "weak" link in the electrical system. GOod luck.
Both battery cables appeared to be new from last summer's restoration. I replaced the short POS cable and the starter cable Saturday. The NEG battery cable was okay at that point.
Sure seems like a hot of heat generated when I'm trying to start. All the cables get hot. And I am not continuously cranking, either. Just very short attempts.
When I first tried to start it this morning, it turned over several times but seems to really be an effort and the sound from the starter seemed really strained, not a metallic grinding but some definite resistance. At least that is my interpretation.
Replace starter.
Replace negative cable with one that is a #4gauge or larger, and clean/sand where you're attching it to the block.
Roger the starter. The cable looks like 4 gauge. I know the new POS cable I put on was 4 guage. Would a #2 be better? And should both battery cables be the same, or does it matter?
Sounds like you have a bad connection where the cable bolts to the block. Just went through that yeasterday myself. Rust and paint between the cable and the engine block make for a bad connection. If the cable started smoking then you need a new one even if it wasn't the initial problem.
The top three problems I've seen over the years with problems like yours are:
1 Bad connections
2 Bad connections
3 Bad connections
Can't remember how many I've fixed over the years. "We've replaced the starter twice. The battery. The alternator/solenoid/etc, etc. But never checked the actual cable connections. For some reason people never seem to focus on their grounds.
I like big fat #2 battery cables but they are no help without good solid connections at both ends.
Keep in mind that all the current that was passing through the POS cable (enough to melt it) also had to go through the NEG cable. That's the nature of electricity. It sounds highly likely that your NEG cable has some problems you just don't see from the outside.
Your update at 8:17 this morning, where you describe the smoke from the NEG cable, I think I'm on to something...
Sounds like you have a bad connection where the cable bolts to the block. Just went through that yeasterday myself. Rust and paint between the cable and the engine block make for a bad connection. If the cable started smoking then you need a new one even if it wasn't the initial problem.
The top three problems I've seen over the years with problems like yours are:
1 Bad connections
2 Bad connections
3 Bad connections
Can't remember how many I've fixed over the years. "We've replaced the starter twice. The battery. The alternator/solenoid/etc, etc. But never checked the actual cable connections. For some reason people never seem to focus on their grounds.
I like big fat #2 battery cables but they are no help without good solid connections at both ends.
I'll go through all the connections, one by one, to make sure they're all bright and tight. That was the cure for my 52 8N Tractor once. Just one little old dirty connection.
I'm betting bad ground connection at the block. I had the same symptons years ago. Used a wire brush and lacqure thinner to clean it up.
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68 GT Vert - J Code (1st car I ever drove in '73, dad bought it in '71)
67 C Code Vert Sports Sprint (1st car I ever bought in '75)
06 Vista Blue with Pony Package (1st Mustang I ever bought new)
MCA #49294 Grayson, GA (Atlanta)
Any chance Your starter cable end is touching metal or the starter body itself ? should sit on bolt and not touch anything else. dead short . It's been awhile installing the cable for Me ,but isn't there an inner and outer nut the cable eye fits between? insulators also ? too cold to look at mine in garage.
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1970 mach1 blue
1961 T-bird convertible, possible 1961 Elvis movie , "Follow that Dream " red florida car
1991 Mustang GT convertible
previously owned
1971 mach1 429SCJ Grabber Yellow
1969 Cougar XR7 428 CJ
1965 Mustang GT Fastback
1965 Mustang fastback
1968 Torino notchback
1958 Thunderbird
1976 Mustang cobra II 302 4spd
1979 Mustang Cobra Turbo 4
1980 Mustang 4
1970 Dodge Challenger R/t 440
1968 Firebird 400
Today I went to buy a new NEG cable since the other one had a small melting issue near the block a couple of days ago. I went ahead and switched to 1 guage for both battery cables. I wire brushed all connections to get them clean and bright and put everything back together.
Next I tried to direct jump the starter with a jumper cable (heavy duty) between the POS terminal on the battery and the Starter terminal. I got the same result as when I was trying it with the ignition switch: about a one second groan and a one quarter turn of the fan blade. I then tried adding the the other jumper cable grounded to the starter housing and the NEG terminal on the battery. Same result.
I'm pretty sure I have ruled out any connection issue. Can I be pretty certain at this point that it is the starter? If so, I'm going to replace it, not have it rebuilt.
Will any auto parts store starter suffice or should I order something special?
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Slowly restoring and improving dads '68 289 Coupe...
