frozen and stranded last night - thinking through next steps

[22GT]

Originally Posted by Milo Bloom

Looking at it that way... would the coolant freezing up cause non-starting? Also, I have Pertronix... can that get too cold to work right?

No. An engine iced solid should still start. Later, it boils over, because while the water in the engine melts, the water in the radiator doesn't.

Never thought of that. The DIS in my 90 Thunderbird SC failed one winter. On relatively warm mornings, it would start right up, but when cold it would just crank. Took a few days for the part to come, and I made the mistake of stopping on the way home, in bitter cold, thought it would stay warm long enough. Oops. So I went back in, got a cup of black coffee, poured it on the module, and went home.

My Mustang has always run on points, and the only time it didn't start was -12°F.

[Renegade600]

I would put a jug of ISO in the tank in the winter...keeps the system moisture from freezing...
When you start it, give it a pump or two and hold the throttle open some.... if you do flood it, hold the pedal to the floor and crank it to clear it...

The distributor cap being wet could be an issue, most times not.

This is not fuel injected so you need to be an active participant in starting these when cold..... but they do go.....

I grew up in Northern Wisconsin, and grew up driving old piece-o-crap cars... Almost every one of them were reliable starters in winter...always outside, sometimes for a week in sub-zero temps...very few ever let me down.....each one had it's own way it wanted to be started.... kind of like a woman... hahaha (no offense to the ladies)...

[buflash]

Originally Posted by Bucket Lister

Seriously, we all love vintage mustangs here on the forum, but few of us would expect a 48 year old carbureted, points ignition car to perform daily in below freezing, snowy, icy, salty conditions. Are you sure that your not expecting more than is reasonable?

If few would expect it, then many are mislead. Age of the car has nothing to do with it except if worn out parts have not been rebuilt or replaced. These engines were designed for year round use in cold climates and that same reliability is absolutely 100% achievable today. I drove mine regularly in temperatures on either side of 10 degrees, bone stock with no modern enhancements.

[Gas_Pumps]

How did I get to school and work every day in my '46 Ford, my '49 Ford, '51Buick and '56 Volkwagen. They were "OLD" cars.

[bartl]

I drove so many carbureted, points-ignited cars, including my '65 K-code in Vermont winters where sometimes we'd go a month without getting above 0*F and never had a problem that wasn't caused by something like a bad battery, old spark plugs or worn points, but it was common practice to do a fall tune-up and make sure everything was tip-top. Accidentally flooding the engine can be cleared by holding the pedal to the floor WITHOUT PUMPING, until the engine catches and clears. Cranking can be improved by using 10W-30, making sure the battery and connections are tight and even a battery blanket can help, and always cranking with the clutch pedal depressed so we weren't trying to spin the input shaft of the tranny in heavy gear oil. Adding isopropyl dry gas to the tank on a regular basis to absorb water was a definite requirement.

I'd pull the plugs and if they're gas fouled don't even bother to clean, just replace. Check and set your points and make sure everything is dry.

While tank heaters are nice because everything is warm and you get instant heat, less expensive solutions like dipstick heaters or magnetic oil pan heaters work okay. Also a battery heater combined with a battery blanket will get the most out of your battery. A battery at 0*F only has 40% output capacity of one at 80*F

KI-KB5015: 4D Battery Heater Pad 50 watt, 120vac, 8.25" X 13",

[victor]

Back in the day, these cars ran in all weather. As has been said, look at your ignition parts first. Could be a bad cap, bad rotor, bad coil, a wire or connector that doesn't like the cold, etc. I think it's the ignition. You might just need to tow it home and closely inspect everything. After you charge the battery, pull a plug put the wire back on and turn it over to see if you have spark at the plug. If not work backwards. If so, look at fuel and air cleaner....

[Milo Bloom]

I think my biggest problem is that I'm only having these problems in the parking lot at work. When I get it home and it's in the garage, it's been fine. When it's above 35 degrees, it's been fine. What I'm going to have to do I guess is leave it out in the driveway sometime when it gets this cold again.

Can someone refresh my memory on the socket size for the spark plug... I seem to recall it being 11/16th or 13/16th something like that and not in my normal set... gotta make sure I bring it with me.

[jvercellino]

13/16", Milo.

[victor]

Weird, conditional failures, are frustrating. Yes, check absolutely everything and leave it out to get good and cold. Could be something as simply as a broken wire that parts in extreme cold. I've had that happen. A couple of needles and an ohm meter showed the wire. I had to remove each wire, connect the meter and manipulate the wire. In my case it was the (+) going to the coil. Frustrating....

[yelostang]

Ages ago, going to NIU in West. Ill, went through my last winter there with a 51 Ford cvt. Every night, brought the battery inside. Gas station put in a winter weight oil, checked the tank, kept it full.They added something, don't remember what. That ol' 6volt. V-8 flathead started every morning. Pull choke all the way out
After a very light spritz of ether it started. It was a stick and it would take patience to get it into 2nd! It got to -20 a few AM's. Getting on rt 30 drove it about 4 mi each AM
and found a parking space where the sun hit it!

Re the ether....a guy I knew put a bit too much in 55 Plymouth V-8. New engine itis!

[daves67ss]

Originally Posted by Bucket Lister

Seriously, we all love vintage mustangs here on the forum, but few of us would expect a 48 year old carbureted, points ignition car to perform daily in below freezing, snowy, icy, salty conditions. Are you sure that your not expecting more than is reasonable?

If properly maintained, there is no reason they wouldn't behave properly in the cold/wet weather.

[Milo Bloom]

I believe I've got a coil or coil wire problem and possibly have fried my starter in the process. Pretty sure of the former, not sure of the latter.

I like to check for spark with my timing light, at least initially. I got spark on the 1st cylinder, but when I put the tester on the coil wire I only got a couple of flashes instead of a constant flash. So I put in a spare coil I had sitting around that I don't use because I got it really hot once. But while I was putting it on, it slipped out of my hand and the weight of the coil snapped the wire at the end of the connector. So that connection may have been OK to the point where it was working in decent weather but too poor to work in very cold weather. The coil itself is a Flamethrower and is less than a year old with only about 10K miles on it, so I'd be surprised if that went bad so quickly, but who knows.

I crimped on a new connector and got everything hooked back up, and the engine almost caught a couple times, but then the battery got too weak. But to make things even more awesome, my stupid 2013 Dodge Avenger rental has a battery that's located between the front bumper and front tire. It's set up with remote battery terminal posts for jumping purposes, but they don't work for crap - I couldn't get a good enough connection for a jump. (My brother just bought a used BMW M3 with some ridiculous setup like this and it cost him $800 to have the battery replaced - another reason I like my Mustang. But I digress.)

So I took the battery back home and have it charged up again now. I'm headed up in an hour or so with the battery, a new coil and a new starter just in case - the one in there is at least from 1985, if it's not original, and I was planning on replacing it at some point anyway. Hopefully I come back with an entire car this time.

[Milo Bloom]

And we have success. Some combination of the coil wire, coil and starter. I had to put both the coil and starter in. Seems I killed the starter trying to crank it so much in the cold since it wouldn't fire because of the coil issue. The symptom I thought was a dead battery yesterday was actually a seized starter.

So, net result is new coil, new battery, new starter. Wish I hadn't had to spend $235 on a rental car but it certainly could have been worse. Thanks everyone for your assistance and suggestions.

[Idaho Stanger]

I'm happy for you Milo, at least you got her going again, and she's back at home with you.

[buflash]

Yeah nice work! Been following this intently hoping you would get her going. Thanks for updating us to let us know what it was. Hopefully you can get back to the joy of driving her again!