Looking to buy a Mustang. Need some advice!

[freshandfly101]

Hi everyone,
My name is David, I'm new here, and just had a few questions if any of you can answer them.

Im looking for a '68-'70 mustang, due to the added collapsible steering column in 1968. I'm looking to pay around 5-6k, which can get a used one, although not in an amazing, yet running, condition, according to my research on craigslist and auto trader. It will not be a daily driver, its just that its always been a dream car, and I will drive it maybe once every one or two weeks.

Since I am concerned with safety, and I know that these 'stangs aren't the safest, my questions are about making it safer.

1. About how much would it cost to install this roll cage? Lemons and Chumps Roll Cage 69 73 Ford Mustang Cougar | eBay

2. Will the door still be fully functional with the above roll cage installed?

3. I will be replacing the standard seat with a modern sports seat (recaro, sparco, etc.) ; can those seats still be installed with the above roll cage in place?

4. Given the rear gas tank explosion issue, I will install tankarmor, but also want to install a rear firewall; any ideas as to where I can get one, and how much it would cost to install?

Thanks in advance,
David

[GT350R Klone]

Unless this is going to be a car that you will be racing, I can't see the value in the roll cage. The biggest gain in safety will be to make sure the brakes, steering, suspension, wheels and tires are up for the task.

[supershifter2]

Originally Posted by freshandfly101

Hi everyone,
My name is David, I'm new here, and just had a few questions if any of you can answer them.

Im looking for a '68-'70 mustang, due to the added collapsible steering column in 1968. I'm looking to pay around 5-6k, which can get a used one, although not in an amazing, yet running, condition, according to my research on craigslist and auto trader. It will not be a daily driver, its just that its always been a dream car, and I will drive it maybe once every one or two weeks.

Since I am concerned with safety, and I know that these 'stangs aren't the safest, my questions are about making it safer.

1. About how much would it cost to install this roll cage? Lemons and Chumps Roll Cage 69 73 Ford Mustang Cougar | eBay

2. Will the door still be fully functional with the above roll cage installed?

3. I will be replacing the standard seat with a modern sports seat (recaro, sparco, etc.) ; can those seats still be installed with the above roll cage in place?

4. Given the rear gas tank explosion issue, I will install tankarmor, but also want to install a rear firewall; any ideas as to where I can get one, and how much it would cost to install?

Thanks in advance,
David

as for not being the safest i have owned many 65-66 mustangs sttarting in 1973. i'v never seen a 65-70 torn in half like waht happens to news cars. i live in los angeles i see wrecks on a regular basis. i see lots of news cars split in half and the passengers dead. the early mustang is made with thicker steel sheets and is all steel and thats much stronger than thinner sheet steel and plastic. i have seen in person and on the news newer cars that were rear ended and the gas tank exploaded and burned the people to death. the only mustangs i put a roll cage in are my track cars. it does help to have a colapseable steering column, dual master cylinder, disc brakes, shoulder harness and high back seats. millions of people survived the automoblie since its beginning. millions survived riding in cars from the 50's, 60's, 70's. even stock cars with full cages and racing harneses arent death proof, just ask Dale and the other stock car drivers that have ben killed the last 20 years. you could just as easily get killed on an airplane, train or in a 2006 chevy malibu that my 06 f350 pickup destroyed. yep, one night about a year ago a woman in turned in front of my 06 f350 on a 4 lane street where the speed limit is 45 and if someone had ben on the passenger side they would be dead. i hit the antilock brakes but i was almost to the intersection when she turned. she wasnt hurt very bad and said she doent know why she decided to turn in front of me. the damage to my truck was a bent bumper and a small crack in the grill. i drove away while her car was put on a flatbed. never assume that you are safer in a new car, there are lots of f250,f350 and larger trucks on the road.

p.s. one of my 66 fastback was rear ended by a guy in a 1974 chevy caprice. i was stopped and witnesses said the guy was going about 75. the gas tank didnt expload or catch fire. i posted fotos of it on here a while back. you should be able to find them. like i posted above , i have seen newer cars blow up and kill people nothing is death proof.

[LynnBob 65 Mustang]

Agreed, a roll cage is total overkill for the street.

Defensive driving is your safest and cheapest route to safety, the rest of the bolt on modern parts just enhance it.

From what I've read with all the millions of Mustangs made compared to what were actually damaged to gas tank fires... You gotta better chance at winning the lotto then getting a gas tank fire. The news likes to take things and blow them all out of proportion without telling you everything.

Lynn

[1-18-68]

A rollcage in a street car is a total waste of money and not necessary. You would be better off getting steering brakes etc up to 100%. I would much prefer to face an accident in an old Mustang than one of the modern sub compacts. I recently had a driver in their SMart Car turn in front of my diesel F-350 for no reason. I stopped and she flipped me off...... gratitude I guess. I stop in time and she was texting instead of driving. Glad it wasn't my insurance that has to bury her. Having run with a rescue squad for 10 years back in the late seventies, I had an opportunity to cut victims out of twisted metal. Give me an older car any day.
Probably the greatest danger to your health is buying a rustbucket that was repaired with filler instead of properly. I strongly recommend you get with someone who knows these cars to help you look over potential options. DO NOT let emotion force you into buying a rotten car with a shiney paint job over lots of filler. Maybe a trip to areas that are rust free for your search would also yield great benefits. That, and get in touch with any Mustang clubs in your area. They may have a member burned out on a project or know of a car in the area. Key to your success will be patience.
Best regards

Russ

[Roddster]

Tell us some more.
1) What area of the country do you live in?
2) Roll bar, what? As in What are you doing with the car? Drag/track/tour or ?
3) Paranoid about some phoney news article about tank explosions?
4) 20 gauge metal, some tools, a cardboard template and your bulkhead will be ready.

Oh, and Welcome to the Forum.......

[ToneMT]

Originally Posted by GT350R Klone

Unless this is going to be a car that you will be racing, I can't see the value in the roll cage. The biggest gain in safety will be to make sure the brakes, steering, suspension, wheels and tires are up for the task.

+1 ... agree 100%

[Leeds]

I say stick with your seat upgrade idea but ditch the rest of the plan.

My reasoning is simple- the higher stiffer seats will help prevent whiplash, the other modifications will only help if you're in a demolition derby or drag racing.

[Rebel Racing]

Originally Posted by freshandfly101

1. About how much would it cost to install this roll cage? Lemons and Chumps Roll Cage 69 73 Ford Mustang Cougar | eBay

2. Will the door still be fully functional with the above roll cage installed?

Hi David,

I realy doubt that you "need" a cage like that but if you do, you might be better off finding a shop that builds their own and make it legal to NHRA rules (or whatever sactioning body you are building the car for). I say that because in the long run it maybe cheaper since there will always be cutting and trimming of the tubing to make it fit--I made the mistake the first time around with a cage. Secondly, yes, your doors will still be functional but you will quickly tire from climbing over the bar everytime. Get swing out side bars installed--still NHRA legal (at least it was 8 yr ago when we upgraded to a 12 pt cage--class legal drag car--I did not get them and regret it). As for costs....it's been several yr since we did our cage but I would plan for at least $1000 for the install if you just hand the car to them. I'd give Gene a call at Wild Rides Race Cars in NJ, he'll give you a rough idea of install prices.

[slim]

Welcome. Are you thinking convertible? If not why roll cage?

The exploding gas tank IMO is urban legend. In my younger years was a junk yard (now we say recycler)prowler saw many smashed up Mustangs (hey it was a high production car) never saw a burnt rear end.

I have a 68 (vert...so I live dangerous) collapsable column, disc front brakes, NEW tires, 69 buckets (standard with head restraints).

IMO the biggest life saving thing on new cars is the multiple air bags, haven't seen those added to a vintage car.

By the way Dale Ernhardt was killed in a relatively minor racing crash...broke his neck due to insufficient lateral head restraint.

When driving any car even a 2013 with 8 airbags ABS and wearing a racing suit and helmet the biggest safety device is the driver.


Slim

[bartl]

FWIW, my $0.02...

Originally Posted by freshandfly101

Hi everyone,
My name is David, I'm new here, and just had a few questions if any of you can answer them. Welcome to the addiction!

Im looking for a '68-'70 mustang, due to the added collapsible steering column in 1968. A non-issue. A collapsible column can easily be installed in a '65-67 as well. I'm looking to pay around 5-6k, which can get a used one, although not in an amazing, yet running, condition, according to my research on craigslist and auto trader. It will not be a daily driver, its just that its always been a dream car, and I will drive it maybe once every one or two weeks.

Since I am concerned with safety, and I know that these 'stangs aren't the safest, my questions are about making it safer. They aren't by far, the UNsafest, either. Do they have 24 air bags? No. Are they as safe as any other car of the period? Absolutely.

1. About how much would it cost to install this roll cage? Lemons and Chumps Roll Cage 69 73 Ford Mustang Cougar | eBay

Unless you are racing, (or really driving like a maniac) a roll cage doesn't make much sense. Depending on your state laws, anything that hinders your entrance/exit from the vehicle may, in fact, not be street legal. Now, a hoop or rear braced 4-point bar with a rear crossbar to support a 4 or 5-point harness DOES make sense.

2. Will the door still be fully functional with the above roll cage installed?

The door should be functional but the bigger question is whether you'll have to gut it to give the side bars clearance, or whether your thigh and knee will be up against it, which will sure hurt if you get hit on that side.

3. I will be replacing the standard seat with a modern sports seat (recaro, sparco, etc.) ; can those seats still be installed with the above roll cage in place?

That depends on the exact measurements once the bar is installed. There is, however, a safety bonus in upgrading the seat to one with better lateral support and a headrest or, if you're doing a rear-seat delete, a fixed backrest.

4. Given the rear gas tank explosion issue, I will install tankarmor, but also want to install a rear firewall; any ideas as to where I can get one, and how much it would cost to install?

What explosion issue? In my 40 years of driving and junkyard surfing I have yet to see a Mustang that caught fire from a rear end collision. This scenario is best solved with Tank Armor. Once done there is no need for a "rear firewall".

Thanks in advance,
David

You're welcome. Here are my choices of safety upgrades to the "vintage" Mustang that make sense, in addition to what I've noted, above:

a. Dual-circuit brake system (Master Cylinder and combination valve)
b. Brighter lamps (headlights, stop and turn signals)
c. Intermittent wipers
d. Hazard Flashers and backup lamps(for '65's not originally equipped)
e. Convex right-side exterior mirror
f. Larger inside day/night mirror

Of course, the biggest safety item is having a vehicle that is in top mechanical condition. Brakes that work without pulling or grabbing, tight steering, good springs and shocks, engine that doesn't hesitate or stall, etc. This will help keep you out of potential trouble.

When I worked for the DMV and reviewed accident reports, in many cases severe injuries or fatalities were caused by failure of the occupants to be properly restrained. Some were fully or partially ejected, but in most cases they contacted something (or someone) else in the vehicle. Heads hitting side glass or A and B pillars, the passengers head, windshield, dash and steering wheels, etc. While a 3-point belt prevents forward movement, your upper body and head can still move side to side - that's why I prefer at least a 4-point restraint be available, especially if you're going to auto-x or do track time.

[afrett]

The problem with a roll cage for street use is that a cage is really designed to be used with a helmet along with padding on the bar in areas close to your head. Your body can move quite a bit in a wreck and your head might hit one of the bars.

I've driven around with a roll bar on the street to drive to the track but it might not be such a good idea without a helmet.

[Garth66]

Originally Posted by bartl

FWIW, my $0.02...
You're welcome. Here are my choices of safety upgrades to the "vintage" Mustang that make sense, in addition to what I've noted, above:

a. Dual-circuit brake system (Master Cylinder and combination valve)
b. Brighter lamps (headlights, stop and turn signals)
c. Intermittent wipers
d. Hazard Flashers and backup lamps(for '65's not originally equipped)
e. Convex right-side exterior mirror
f. Larger inside day/night mirror

Of course, the biggest safety item is having a vehicle that is in top mechanical condition. Brakes that work without pulling or grabbing, tight steering, good springs and shocks, engine that doesn't hesitate or stall, etc. This will help keep you out of potential trouble.

When I worked for the DMV and reviewed accident reports, in many cases severe injuries or fatalities were caused by failure of the occupants to be properly restrained. Some were fully or partially ejected, but in most cases they contacted something (or someone) else in the vehicle. Heads hitting side glass or A and B pillars, the passengers head, windshield, dash and steering wheels, etc. While a 3-point belt prevents forward movement, your upper body and head can still move side to side - that's why I prefer at least a 4-point restraint be available, especially if you're going to auto-x or do track time.

All excellent recommendations. You definitely should add 3-point seat belts at a minimum. I have mixed feelings about 4-point harnesses when a cage is not present - I have a friend who totaled his Pantera (went off the road and rolled at 180 mph) and would have surely died if he had a 4-point harness; the stock 3-point seat belts allowed his body to lean over when the roof was crushed down flush with the top of the doors. And, as others have already stated, a full cage on the street is entirely unnecessary and more dangerous if not wearing a helmet given there's hard object in close proximity to one's head.

[jmj6879]

Well this thread is a bit depressing... I'm adding headrests to my seats and 3 point belts, adding disc brakes and upgrading the lamps but that said, if you drive with some sense and maintain your car properly your risk drops to that of any other car. I treat it like riding a motorcycle, keep your head up and your eyes open.

[Renegade600]

All good advice above.... great brakes, good steering, items re-built and solid make these cars pretty safe as long as you respect that they are 40+ years old....

Regarding a cage, I have one in my semi-street car, a '90 Fox body LX but this car has run various power adders from Nitrous to twin turbos... having a cage in the car is kind of a pain as you have to crawl over the bar.....a side benefit is to see my sons girlfriends try to crawl in to it when he takes it out....
Tom