Compare full front suspension packages for 67 vert - Vintage Mustang Forums
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post #1 of 27 (permalink) Old 03-07-2019, 01:38 PM Thread Starter
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Compare full front suspension packages for 67 vert

For a 67 Vert with 302, 4speed, 8” 3.80 rear gears.
Already committed to stock rear suspension with factory GT 114# leafs and KYB shocks.

I am soon installing 13” cobra disks in front using Steve’s brackets and 01 Bullitt 17x8 wheels.

I might eventually add EPS power steering, but for now the manual steering is probably staying as is.

My current front springs are way off and ride really high. I need to either cut or replace them. And do the 1”drop

So.,,,,,,

If I wanted to throw caution to the wind, and order up a full front suspension package,, What are the pro vs con.
Street or track looks real nice. Very similar to Global West. TCP? Any others worth looking at?

Maybe even one tracker, but really like the idea of going struts mounted to LCA.

Consider $3k the max budget for just the suspension.

Which would you buy, and why?

mark
----------------------------
04 SVT Cobra, Torch Red (daily driver)
67 'vert 302,4spd,Red/Red (almost ready!)
67 Coupe 289,auto,black/black,deluxe (sold)
67 Coupe I6 to V8 conversion (sold)
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post #2 of 27 (permalink) Old 03-08-2019, 05:13 PM
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Street or Track would be my bet....
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post #3 of 27 (permalink) Old 03-08-2019, 06:03 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by caveeagle View Post
For a 67 Vert with 302, 4speed, 8” 3.80 rear gears.
Already committed to stock rear suspension with factory GT 114# leafs and KYB shocks.

I am soon installing 13” cobra disks in front using Steve’s brackets and 01 Bullitt 17x8 wheels.

I might eventually add EPS power steering, but for now the manual steering is probably staying as is.

My current front springs are way off and ride really high. I need to either cut or replace them. And do the 1”drop

So.,,,,,,

If I wanted to throw caution to the wind, and order up a full front suspension package,, What are the pro vs con.
Street or track looks real nice. Very similar to Global West. TCP? Any others worth looking at?

Maybe even one tracker, but really like the idea of going struts mounted to LCA.

Consider $3k the max budget for just the suspension.

Which would you buy, and why?
SoT, Global West, TCP, Maier Racing are all very fine companies producing quality products. Tubular upper and lower control arms, roller bearing everything... all great stuff. I don’t think opentracker offers tubular components, but IIRC offers components that are reinforced and rollerized. Again, all great.

So, pros and cons are related to what you plan on doing with the car. Road course racing? AutoX? Drag racing? Lumbering along to get ice cream in the weekend?

ASSUMING you are looking at great handling being the primary goal (as in capable of some racing, or really aggressive canyon carving), then my money would go towards companies who actively race. Lots of folks stand by SoT and Opentracker. Both are solid choices. Maier has great prodcts, but outside of your stated budget.

You really cant go wrong buying from a company that specialises in early mustangs. Differences between any of the above is splitting hairs.

Whatever you go with, and still under the same assumption above, I would at least change the rear shocks to compliment the front suspension shocks.

Happy hunting.

-Chris

'68 Mustang
347ci that has a lot of neat stuff in it
T5 manual trans, alum driveshaft, 9" w/3.70 gears
Suspension parts from SoT, Global West, Maier Racing, and a few others. Works for me!
TCP manual rack (love it)
EPAS (Love this the most)
VWW V45 wheels (like these too)
SoT 13" brakes (stopping is good)
And I finally got a paint job!
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post #4 of 27 (permalink) Old 03-08-2019, 06:15 PM
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Open tracker if you want a stockish look, but upgraded

Street or Track if you want a blingish look, yet very functional
tough call ,I drove @Huskinhano 's car and it rode very nice He has the Street or Track suspension


Brad
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post #5 of 27 (permalink) Old 03-08-2019, 06:55 PM
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One of the failings of the original design is the limited caster that can be “dialed-in.” The modern spec recommended by most is for +3º or more caster. This is needed for that “return to center – hands off steer straight” feel of modern steering. To accomplish this the strut rods are adjusted to pull the lower control arm forward with the result being the tire is moved forward sufficiently to rub the fender. The solution is an upper control arm that re-positions the ball joint back to give some build in caster. Opentracker has that, but at a price. Street or Track has that, as does Global West and Hotchkis.
If you’re only driving to the Dairy Queen, or the local car show, this is not important. But if you plan to drive distance it is necessary.
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post #6 of 27 (permalink) Old 03-08-2019, 07:51 PM
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Good suppliers mentioned already. I’d buy this...https://opentrackerracing.com/produc...l-2-1967-1970/...mostly because I already did for my ‘66, with a few upgrades.

How do you like that 3.8 rear with the TL? What RPM does your engine turn at highway speeds...70’ish? What diameter tire?

Regards,
Patrick
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post #7 of 27 (permalink) Old 03-09-2019, 09:28 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CJM68GT390 View Post
One of the failings of the original design is the limited caster that can be “dialed-in.” The modern spec recommended by most is for +3º or more caster. This is needed for that “return to center – hands off steer straight” feel of modern steering. To accomplish this the strut rods are adjusted to pull the lower control arm forward with the result being the tire is moved forward sufficiently to rub the fender. The solution is an upper control arm that re-positions the ball joint back to give some build in caster. Opentracker has that, but at a price. Street or Track has that, as does Global West and Hotchkis.
If you’re only driving to the Dairy Queen, or the local car show, this is not important. But if you plan to drive distance it is necessary.

This is a great advice and comment. The lack of caster is a problem and since the build quality is iffy and different on each car is going to be added into the mix of problems. The best place to start is to have a basic knowledge of how these suspensions work and their faults and how you want as CJM68 said hit the nail on the head.

The advantage of using Opentracker or Street or Track is that both guys actually race their products. You call, you’re speaking to them directly not a phone jockey. Global West and Maer also make excellent products that you should check. I went with SoT because their arms are adjustable for more caster over stock arms. I went with the SoT over Global West for two reasons. GW uses bushings that are proprietary and that the shaft bolts are larger so in the event you had to use a different arm other then theirs, you’re stuck. The SoT are fully rebuildable with off the shelf parts anywhere. I’m not a fan of the TCP control arms to set alignment. Since these cars are not precision built and years of street abuse the unibody is not the same side to side sometimes and therefore you’re going to end up with two different length upper control arms side to side. It opens the door door “intrestresting” handling. With any adjustable control arm they need to be mirror images of each other and finished off shimming them to finish alignment.

My other comments things like lowering the upper arm and adding caster will both lower the front suspension. Invest in good shocks. Any time you can replace a rubber bushing for a steel bearing, the better! It will not adversely effect ride quality. In fact most of the time improves it. Before adding power assist steering install a roller bearing idler arm. Not only will it ease steering effort since it’s not fighting a rubber bushing but it adds a lot to precise steering.
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post #8 of 27 (permalink) Old 03-09-2019, 11:17 AM
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Street or Track if you have $3k to spend hands down, best bolt in kit available and excellent customer service.
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post #9 of 27 (permalink) Old 03-09-2019, 05:38 PM Thread Starter
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Street or Track if you have $3k to spend hands down, best bolt in kit available and excellent customer service.
This is the direction I was leaning towards. I am not likely to be road racing it, but would like something to give it more modern handling and feel.

I’m really not into the bling factor, at all. But am afraid going with the opentraker, upgraded stock designs will just leaving me wanting more.

I really like the idea of going with struts that connect to the LCA, but that’s not based on anything more that “it looks better to me”.

Is this design actually superior in a car like this? Does this give me the ability to adjust ride height? Or spring rate?

mark
----------------------------
04 SVT Cobra, Torch Red (daily driver)
67 'vert 302,4spd,Red/Red (almost ready!)
67 Coupe 289,auto,black/black,deluxe (sold)
67 Coupe I6 to V8 conversion (sold)
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post #10 of 27 (permalink) Old 03-09-2019, 05:45 PM Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by patrickstapler View Post
Good suppliers mentioned already. I’d buy this...https://opentrackerracing.com/produc...l-2-1967-1970/...mostly because I already did for my ‘66, with a few upgrades.

How do you like that 3.8 rear with the TL? What RPM does your engine turn at highway speeds...70’ish? What diameter tire?
So far the 3.80 with a close ratio TL seems like the best compromise. I initially had 3.25 gears and that was horrible. Getting off the line was painful. The 3.80 axle x 2.32 1st gear give you a starting ratio of 8.82, which Is about as low a # as I would want in a smallblock that is not exactly a torque-monster.

I have not really driven it much since together, but I am somewhere around 2800rpm at 60-65, although I am not totally confident in the Aussie mini tach I have. My motor is a solid cam, 650dp w head work and tri-Y headers, so it seems to like to rev a little.

mark
----------------------------
04 SVT Cobra, Torch Red (daily driver)
67 'vert 302,4spd,Red/Red (almost ready!)
67 Coupe 289,auto,black/black,deluxe (sold)
67 Coupe I6 to V8 conversion (sold)
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post #11 of 27 (permalink) Old 03-10-2019, 11:56 AM
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Is this design actually superior in a car like this? Does this give me the ability to adjust ride height? Or spring rate?

Yes you can adjust ride height and I imagine spring rate if Shaun sells different springs, but sure its optimized for classic mustang. I had the setup on my car and the quality was unavailable. Only reason I got rid of it was for the coyote swap.
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post #12 of 27 (permalink) Old 03-10-2019, 03:37 PM
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I agree with Tom 99% of the time. We both independently of each other discovered the need to shim our front upper shocks to ensure they have full travel available to them and are not bottoming out. He is a knowledgeable guy, but I do not agree about TCP upper control arms. I've had them on my 65 for coming up on 20 years now.

My old factory suspension was completely shot and my front end could no longer be aligned with shims (as in there were so many shims shoved in there that there was literally no more room for even a single additional shim). I was going through a set of front tires every 2-3000 miles. It was bad. Now I don't know if it was because the suspension was worn out or due to accident damage prior to me owning the car ( I've never had the frame measured), but I wanted to do away with the shims. I decided on TCP specifically for that reason. I installed them with the arning drop and all new poly suspension...roller stuff hadn't hit the market yet. I've been completely happy with the way my car drives and handles since then.

I understand what his point is about needing to make sure they are set the same as each other as far as total length goes, but that is no reason to avoid a quality product. And for guys that may have some frame damage or other issues they do offer more adjustability than stock could ever dream of.

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post #13 of 27 (permalink) Old 03-10-2019, 04:51 PM
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Originally Posted by caveeagle View Post
This is the direction I was leaning towards. I am not likely to be road racing it, but would like something to give it more modern handling and feel.

I’m really not into the bling factor, at all. But am afraid going with the opentraker, upgraded stock designs will just leaving me wanting more.

I really like the idea of going with struts that connect to the LCA, but that’s not based on anything more that “it looks better to me”.

Is this design actually superior in a car like this? Does this give me the ability to adjust ride height? Or spring rate?
I wouldn’t shy away from Opentracker. He makes excellent products and customer service. Giving you my hindsight 20/20 the biggest aspects are going to be lowering the upper control arms, good shocks and getting rid of the rubber bushings. It’s not all about how hard you can corner but many times how the car feels in every day driving. The bearings just add a great precise feel. Opentracker also strengthens the control arms.

Other equalizers are going to be how well the car is set up with alignment and tires.
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post #14 of 27 (permalink) Old 03-10-2019, 05:24 PM
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Originally Posted by Huskinhano View Post
I wouldn’t shy away from Opentracker. He makes excellent products and customer service. Giving you my hindsight 20/20 the biggest aspects are going to be lowering the upper control arms, good shocks and getting rid of the rubber bushings. It’s not all about how hard you can corner but many times how the car feels in every day driving. The bearings just add a great precise feel. Opentracker also strengthens the control arms.

Other equalizers are going to be how well the car is set up with alignment and tires.
Nope,at the end of the day It's about how hard you can corner
Yes, alignment and tires
The best street tires of today will out perform the best track tires of the past
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post #15 of 27 (permalink) Old 03-10-2019, 06:04 PM
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Another vote for Shawn at Street or Track. He is great to deal with. I purchased the tubular front end kit and his 13" brakes up front and the stock 11" brakes with Porterfield pads on the 8.8 Explorer rearend out back. Cars handles well and stops on a dime, straight and true. Running manual brakes and the feeling is solid, predictable with just a slightly heavier brake pedal feel compared to vacuum booster, I really like it! Will upgrade rear brakes someday to 12"


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