Leaf Spring Change 5 leaf to? - Page 2 - Vintage Mustang Forums
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post #16 of 25 (permalink) Old 05-18-2019, 08:31 AM
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If you are not doing a watts link or panhard, look at the del alum bushings. I think the ease of motion makes things feel a little less harsh.
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post #17 of 25 (permalink) Old 05-18-2019, 12:41 PM Thread Starter
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If you are not doing a watts link or panhard, look at the del alum bushings. I think the ease of motion makes things feel a little less harsh.
Thanks, I think that's worth looking at, and easy to do. Keeping in mind that I already have the aluminum bushing that comes with the Caltrac's in the front. Adding the del alum bushings, isn't going to make any noticeable change to the road noise that exists now.

I was researching the Cat5 springs, but I think the consensus is that they are a very stiff and a race only spring.


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post #18 of 25 (permalink) Old 05-18-2019, 06:08 PM
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Thanks, I think that's worth looking at, and easy to do. Keeping in mind that I already have the aluminum bushing that comes with the Caltrac's in the front. Adding the del alum bushings, isn't going to make any noticeable change to the road noise that exists now.

I was researching the Cat5 springs, but I think the consensus is that they are a very stiff and a race only spring.
Im reasonably sure you can get an L-11 in a cat 5.
I think the cat 5 is about as advanced as a leaf spring can get...
Mary Pozzi ran then for years in her camaro

Last edited by Jsams; 05-18-2019 at 06:11 PM.
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post #19 of 25 (permalink) Old 05-24-2019, 03:20 PM
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Given you donít have a sway bar, Watts Link, or Panhard Link, I guess Iím a little surprised it oversteers. But thatís a more comfortable way around the corner provided itís not acting like a drift car. My personal favorite is the adjustable Watts Link since moving CG (Center of Gravity) is a simple ten minute adjustment, a tight car that refuses to rotate can quickly be loosened up to rotate easily. And you donít really need to understand anything but the very basics.

The Fays unit has proven to work and to last. Some good quality, round, short, mufflers and side exhaust is an easy way and it does not have to be harsh. You can get the exhaust out the back, I ran mine that way for a couple of years, but it takes a muffler shop with a guy willing to get it done. And a big tip when he does.

Back in the early seventies the general idea was to spring it hard and dampen it hard, not a very compliant suspension. That thinking has evolved to spring it soft(er) and dampen it hard(ish). Or dampen it to the needs of the track. So softer springs will allow the suspension to work and follow the bumps and dips, dampen with adjustable shocks to the needs of the track, add the Watts, and youíll find you can fly. Or just do the softer spring that you want, a Watts Link, and youíll still enjoy a car thatís easily adjustable for the conditions.

Small changes in spring numbers is hard to feel, big changes may get you in territory you find too soft. If your current spring is too harsh, maybe itís the damper (or lack of) thatís the real issue? You know your setup far better than me, I guess Iím just voting for the Watts. .

They do have a composite single leaf (sort of like on C5 and later Vetts), it knocks off some sixty or more pounds. Just a thought.

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'66 Fastback
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post #20 of 25 (permalink) Old 05-25-2019, 02:28 PM Thread Starter
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Im reasonably sure you can get an L-11 in a cat 5.
I think the cat 5 is about as advanced as a leaf spring can get...
Mary Pozzi ran then for years in her camaro
Thanks, I used the GW contact form, but no one responded. Probably a tech issue. I'll call them when I cat my car back from the paint shop.

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Originally Posted by 66stangFb View Post
Given you donít have a sway bar, Watts Link, or Panhard Link, I guess Iím a little surprised it oversteers. But thatís a more comfortable way around the corner provided itís not acting like a drift car. My personal favorite is the adjustable Watts Link since moving CG (Center of Gravity) is a simple ten minute adjustment, a tight car that refuses to rotate can quickly be loosened up to rotate easily. And you donít really need to understand anything but the very basics.

The Fays unit has proven to work and to last. Some good quality, round, short, mufflers and side exhaust is an easy way and it does not have to be harsh. You can get the exhaust out the back, I ran mine that way for a couple of years, but it takes a muffler shop with a guy willing to get it done. And a big tip when he does.

Back in the early seventies the general idea was to spring it hard and dampen it hard, not a very compliant suspension. That thinking has evolved to spring it soft(er) and dampen it hard(ish). Or dampen it to the needs of the track. So softer springs will allow the suspension to work and follow the bumps and dips, dampen with adjustable shocks to the needs of the track, add the Watts, and youíll find you can fly. Or just do the softer spring that you want, a Watts Link, and youíll still enjoy a car thatís easily adjustable for the conditions.

Small changes in spring numbers is hard to feel, big changes may get you in territory you find too soft. If your current spring is too harsh, maybe itís the damper (or lack of) thatís the real issue? You know your setup far better than me, I guess Iím just voting for the Watts. .

They do have a composite single leaf (sort of like on C5 and later Vetts), it knocks off some sixty or more pounds. Just a thought.
Thanks a lot for your feedback. I do tend to agree with you, and was planning on approaching it little by little. I think getting the springs correct is where I need to start.
The watts link is also on the radar.

The other issue I have, is that the lowered nature of the car, causes the rear shocks to be at a pretty extreme angle at times under compression. I l already snapped a Bilstien shock. I want to conceive a more freely articulating shock absorber mount, maybe similar to the Mair setup. Until I have that, I have just the generic econo hydraulic shocks.

I found out yesterday when I was at the paint shop, their mechanic stated there was a crack in a weld where the strut rod bracket attaches to the frame. When it gets back, I'll also look into that, to see if that's the case or not.


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post #21 of 25 (permalink) Old 05-25-2019, 05:38 PM
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Interesting, I've never heard of anyone snapping a shock shaft. That would be the first issue to address, a binding shock could definitely cause oversteer and a harsh ride.

'65 A-code coupe, T-10 4-speed, 8" 3.25 limited slip
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post #22 of 25 (permalink) Old 05-26-2019, 11:03 AM
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My personal favorite is the adjustable Watts Link since moving CG (Center of Gravity) is a simple ten minute adjustment, a tight car that refuses to rotate can quickly be loosened up to rotate easily. And you donít really need to understand anything but the very basics.

I am curious which direction e.g. Up or Down makes the car rotate? I had someone tell me up = more rotation so I adjusted mine in several stages ending with it all the way up. It seemed to help but I wouldn't say it was dramatic. I would like to try running looser in the rear this season. More oversteer, I was going to stiffen my rear Shocks today some...

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post #23 of 25 (permalink) Old 05-26-2019, 12:36 PM
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A watts link moves the rear roll center. Raising the pivot raised the roll center and loosens the rear.

1969 coupe
372 Cleveland, 4 speed, 9" T.50 Trac Lock axle, Toploader, Global west suspension, Big Lincoln Trans Am Brakes front, Eldorado caliper/ MK VII disk rear.
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post #24 of 25 (permalink) Old 05-26-2019, 07:04 PM
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Post Something seems wrong

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I am curious which direction e.g. Up or Down makes the car rotate? I had someone tell me up = more rotation so I adjusted mine in several stages ending with it all the way up. It seemed to help but I wouldn't say it was dramatic. I would like to try running looser in the rear this season. More oversteer, I was going to stiffen my rear Shocks today some...
To stiffen the rear shocks could help and play with tire pressure, youíve probable done that by now, so what was your result and are the dampers single or double adjustable?

On the Watts - Sounds like something is not right; when you installed the Watts Link, the left and right links should have been on the same horizontal plane to start (I use a digital level just because I own one and I like being sure); the propeller should lean a few degrees at an angle. This would be neutral, to raise the propeller one notch should loosen the car (over steer) by raising the cars CG or Roll Center and going down then tightens (understeer) the car. One notch is generally noticeably, two for sure is a big change. If you went all the way to the top with the propeller and didnít notice a very big change you are either driving the corner way too slow or you have other setup issues.

I hate to hijack the thread, but: What front suspension do you have and how big a sway bar?

Darrell George
'66 Fastback
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post #25 of 25 (permalink) Old 05-26-2019, 07:10 PM
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To stiffen the rear shocks could help and play with tire pressure, you’ve probable done that by now, so what was your result and are the dampers single or double adjustable?

I hate to hijack the thread, but: What front suspension do you have and how big a sway bar?
I have messed with tire pressures as my sole tuning effort, never messed with shocks. THey are classic Konis single adjustable. 1" sway bar. Couple of years ago, I set the rears to 1/4 - 1/3 from full soft.
I think I found the issue today. I pulled the front shocks as I remember that they were set very stiff and found them set to high. One of the first times I took the car to Sears Point raceway with the Shelby club, a guy who said he set up a vintage racer there and set my front shocks for me. I just cut them back to half way which should change things dramatically and losen the rear up. If its too tail happy, I'll start dropping the Watts, hoping that gives me more oversteer. I want to try running loose this season...

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Last edited by dobrostang; 05-26-2019 at 07:19 PM.
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