Question about converting carb to efi on 64 mustang - Page 2 - Vintage Mustang Forums
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post #16 of 45 (permalink) Old 07-13-2017, 01:18 PM
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I am happy with the Holley EFI. I suggest the sniper kit. $1250 with pump and filter. However, you will need a 4bbl intake.

The only 2bbl EFI I have seen is Holley's Avenger, but it is expensive.

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post #17 of 45 (permalink) Old 07-13-2017, 01:21 PM
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Seems like lots of people like EFI because they just don't want to find the correct carb to start with ? Or even learn to service or tune one. Before I would spend 1500 on that EFI setup, I would read the repair manual and learn. I can actually rebuild a carb in about 20 minutes and she purr like a kitchen. Perhaps just call me tight, It takes a few reads yes but the joy of doing it myself far exceeds anything else. These are not new cars and you can't compare them either.
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post #18 of 45 (permalink) Old 07-13-2017, 01:32 PM
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Originally Posted by bacchus203 View Post
The only 2bbl EFI I have seen is Holley's Avenger, but it is expensive.
Josep's '66 has a Holley ProJection II which is a 2V EFI but the barrels are too large in diameter for a 2V manifold. It is mounted on a Edelbrock Performer 4V manifold.
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post #19 of 45 (permalink) Old 07-13-2017, 01:34 PM
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Seems like lots of people like EFI because they just don't want to find the correct carb to start with ? Or even learn to service or tune one. Before I would spend 1500 on that EFI setup, I would read the repair manual and learn. I can actually rebuild a carb in about 20 minutes and she purr like a kitchen. Perhaps just call me tight, It takes a few reads yes but the joy of doing it myself far exceeds anything else. These are not new cars and you can't compare them either.

Agree, I don't understand the frustration people have with carburetors.

I guess if you start out with a warped frankencarb of mismatched parts and don't have the knowledge to recognize that, it would be challenging.

A little reading to gain an understanding of how they work is all it takes.
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post #20 of 45 (permalink) Old 07-13-2017, 01:35 PM
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Please explain to me how EFI is "better" than a carburetor.
I never said EFI is better than a carb but I fully believe it is. If a carb was better car manufacturers would still be running them today.

I can say that my car will hit by simply turning the key and is ready to immediately leave the garage. No pumping the gas pedal, no having to hold the gas pedal open just the right amount, no waiting for the car to warm up. My car was carbed and its what made me into a believer in EFI. The car had a rebuilt carb on it and a brand new carb, but something was always needing tweaking. Either a float would stick, or the choke would need adjusting, or whatever its not for me.

My 351C 4v and my 428CJ are both running EFI and are both ready to run as soon as the key is turned. I get a kick out of watching my dad fire up his carbed cars and they start and die, or he has to pump the pedal 10 times because the cars have sat to long.
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post #21 of 45 (permalink) Old 07-13-2017, 01:47 PM
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And I can say press the pedal half way and set the choke and and after tap the pedal to release the choke and go, after fully warm after driving , just turn the key afterwards, no further action required . To each his own for sure.


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post #22 of 45 (permalink) Old 07-13-2017, 02:09 PM
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Having learned to drive in the early 70's starting a car with a carb is still second nature. I never had problems starting a carbed car that sat out over night in subzero weather (other then the occasional dead battery) or baked all day under the sun on a day with a temperature of 90 in the shade. You learn to do. The sound and feel of a car with a four barrel carb is one of the best things about driving these old cars.
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post #23 of 45 (permalink) Old 07-13-2017, 02:13 PM
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Originally Posted by cj428mach View Post
I never said EFI is better than a carb but I fully believe it is. If a carb was better car manufacturers would still be running them today.

I can say that my car will hit by simply turning the key and is ready to immediately leave the garage. No pumping the gas pedal, no having to hold the gas pedal open just the right amount, no waiting for the car to warm up. My car was carbed and its what made me into a believer in EFI. The car had a rebuilt carb on it and a brand new carb, but something was always needing tweaking. Either a float would stick, or the choke would need adjusting, or whatever its not for me.

My 351C 4v and my 428CJ are both running EFI and are both ready to run as soon as the key is turned. I get a kick out of watching my dad fire up his carbed cars and they start and die, or he has to pump the pedal 10 times because the cars have sat to long.
All this and more.

Carbs do their job perfectly adequately. But EFI does it so much better and with so much less drama it's not even in the same ballpark. There's a reason many racers have gone to EFI in addition to the OEMs and those of us who have switched will never go back.

Yeah it only takes 20 min to rebuild a carb but you have no choice because it's on its 3rd clog this year because ethanol is destroying your fuel system or it sat for a week and varnished up one main jet and half an air bleed. Or a float's stuck because.. who knows.

With EFI you go and turn the key and it starts. Drive away. You cruise along at 15:1 or so. Give it some gas and it goes to stoich. Give it a bit more and it goes to 12.5:1. Oh, it's pinging a bit under full throttle? Couple clicks and you've pulled out 2 of timing. Needs a bit more timing at idle? No problem. Want 50 more rpm at idle? Sure. Got some sort of issue you're having trouble diagnosing? Data log it and look at the graphs to see what's happening.

You can do all those things if you want but generally you don't even have to.

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post #24 of 45 (permalink) Old 07-13-2017, 02:36 PM
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I grew up driving carbureted cars and don't remember ever having issues. I have had an eddlebrock 1406 on my car since I have owned it, I have learned to rebuild it (which I do about 3x per year like jcoby said, due to this terrible CA gas) and tune it. But it takes a lot of time, nowhere near troublefree. Besides the 3 rebuilds per year I also need to retune it at least twice a year when the weather changes. This typically doesn't bother me because I enjoy tinkering on the car, but I can say I do envy the guys who can just turn the key and go. There is always a little doubt in my mind when I go to crank my car.

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post #25 of 45 (permalink) Old 07-13-2017, 02:36 PM
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All this and more.

Carbs do their job perfectly adequately. But EFI does it so much better and with so much less drama it's not even in the same ballpark. There's a reason many racers have gone to EFI in addition to the OEMs and those of us who have switched will never go back.

Yeah it only takes 20 min to rebuild a carb but you have no choice because it's on its 3rd clog this year because ethanol is destroying your fuel system or it sat for a week and varnished up one main jet and half an air bleed. Or a float's stuck because.. who knows.

With EFI you go and turn the key and it starts. Drive away. You cruise along at 15:1 or so. Give it some gas and it goes to stoich. Give it a bit more and it goes to 12.5:1. Oh, it's pinging a bit under full throttle? Couple clicks and you've pulled out 2 of timing. Needs a bit more timing at idle? No problem. Want 50 more rpm at idle? Sure. Got some sort of issue you're having trouble diagnosing? Data log it and look at the graphs to see what's happening.

You can do all those things if you want but generally you don't even have to.
I was only mentioning things related to fuel control but you bring up a good point with spark control.

I'm not using the spark control of the FiTech as I didn't have any luck with that but when you have spark control its amazing the amount of control you have. My 351C is basically running a Fox EEC4 setup with a 460 TFI distributor and I can control timing at any RPM, any load, and to the nearest .25 degree. Now some might wonder why you need that but when you're trying to avoid knock, or cam surge you can tweak things like you never could with a distributor.

The AFR is also the same kind of adjustability and it can all be seen in a datalog either real time as the car is running or at home on the couch after a nice drive.

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post #26 of 45 (permalink) Old 07-13-2017, 02:57 PM
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I was only mentioning things related to fuel control but you bring up a good point with spark control.

I'm not using the spark control of the FiTech as I didn't have any luck with that but when you have spark control its amazing the amount of control you have.
FWIW, all I had to do was remove the vacuum advance and lock out and stab in a duraspark distributor from a non-roller engine, clip the connector and the black wire, add the MSD molex connector to the other two wires for the pickup signal. I set the rotor position and base according to the docs so it could advance timing and it fired right up. You could probably even get rid of the bigger rotor cap and adapter and run the stock distributor cap and rotor and nobody would even know it's electronic if you kept the vacuum diaphragm in place.

I don't know if any of that would translate to your setup or not; I don't know anything about big blocks.

I'm currently helping to build a turbo 5.3 LS. A carb wasn't even considered.

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post #27 of 45 (permalink) Old 07-13-2017, 03:59 PM
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i addressed that in the later part of my post.

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post #28 of 45 (permalink) Old 07-13-2017, 04:55 PM
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post #29 of 45 (permalink) Old 07-13-2017, 05:22 PM
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I have a Fitech with ignition control unit and it is really FANTASTIC

It is OK to run an 100years old carburator design but remember that most EFI like Sniper and Fitech is also a regular carburator....They are just electric!

And it is sooooooo much better in every way so to those who defend the mechanical carbs please try an EFI before posting how bad you "think" it is.

The extra cost of it is of course high, but the buyer decides if it is worth it.

If you are on a budget buy an mechanical and be prepare to have issues all the time.. Sure you can learn if you like and have the tools.

If you want power, drivability, simple to tune and (maybe) more milage let the computer do the work! But be prepare to spend and installation is hard for most people.

Also you get so much more extra out of an EFI system like control of the ignition and control of the radiator fan!
Aggressive cams suddenly behaves much better with EFI

I have worked with carbs for 20years but EFI has reprogrammed my brain totally!! ....Just hit the key and go!

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Last edited by Per Berglund; 07-13-2017 at 05:34 PM.
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post #30 of 45 (permalink) Old 07-13-2017, 05:42 PM
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For a 260 V8 the FITech 400 hp unit ($795) would be fine (FITech Fuel Injection FiTech 30003 Go Street 400 HP EFI Conversion). You need to spring for a 4 barrel intake though. ebay is your friend (Ford 289-302-5.0 WEIAND 8011 4 barrel intake manifold Mustang Torino GASSER 347 | eBay).

A slighter more difficult swap (but low cost) would be to just get a complete modern EFI off of a totaled V8 Mustang (or other Ford) from the junk yard and swap it all over - lots of threads on that in the forum.

Or even better just get a period correct Ford Autolite carb.

Just my opinion.
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