Did a bunch of work this weekend - Again have some questions - Vintage Mustang Forums
 
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post #1 of 8 (permalink) Old 02-25-2018, 11:46 PM Thread Starter
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Did a bunch of work this weekend - Again have some questions

Steering was super loose and had some pops and clunks, so I decided to freshen up the front end.
Replaced the UCA ball joints, all tie rods (inner and outer) and idler arm with moog components.
Next weekend going to do some coils and and shocks before taking it in for an alignment.

Steering is definitely tightened up! I'm happy with the feel so far, except some concerns that I will outline below.

On a quick test drive, I really had to work to return it to center after turns, especially when turning to the left side. With all of what I replaced, my novice instinct is thinking that alignment is the issue? Too much Positive caster??

I had a heck of a time getting the inner drivers side tie rod out. Even with a compressed air pickle fork. Looking at old rod assembly (inner+outer) for reference, I think the PO had the tie rod installed into the spindle from the Top - which I believe is incorrect. I didn't notice it while i was removing it, but when I tried to see how the old one went it, the orientation of the rod ends led me to believe that it's the only way he could have had it. As a result, I had to eyeball the center position of the wheel, and pretty much had to shorten both DS rod ends to their limits to keep it straight. This is why I'm hoping it's an alignment issue.

Also, the outer passenger side tie rod, I couldn't tighten fully to spec. It kept going and going quite a few threads below the hole for the cotter pin. I didn't have a grease gun to inject it with grease. I doubt thats what it could have been but what the hell do I know.

I wish I took pictures so that I could see what I did, in case I did something incorrectly. The diagrams in the FSM on this topic weren't the greatest, but i was able to find diagrams online and in the install procedure on CJPP.

I also repaired the cylinder boot which fell off on one side and seemed to be a janky generic Autozone special. The cylinder rod looked very clean and didn't have any pitting. It engaged and disengaged evenly without binding. I definitely torqued that down to spec.

As I install the rest of my suspension next weekend, do you have any suggestions for me to check?

In addition to re-checking my work, I will look at the PS belt, fluid.

Thanks for reading! looking forward to your comments

Last edited by WeTheNorth; 02-26-2018 at 12:02 AM.
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post #2 of 8 (permalink) Old 02-25-2018, 11:54 PM Thread Starter
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Oh and for the record, I couldn't grease the tie rods since I didn't have a grease gun.

The ball joint had an attachable boot, and I packed some grease in there.
The idler arm was pre-greased and the instructions said none was required.
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post #3 of 8 (permalink) Old 02-26-2018, 12:30 AM
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Originally Posted by WeTheNorth View Post
Oh and for the record, I couldn't grease the tie rods since I didn't have a grease gun.

The ball joint had an attachable boot, and I packed some grease in there.
The idler arm was pre-greased and the instructions said none was required.
I would definitely get a grease gun and shoot some in there to make sure the complete surfaces are greased from the inside out.

Also, maybe a washer would have helped torquing down the tie rod nut to get the castle nut even with the cotter pin hole.

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post #4 of 8 (permalink) Old 02-26-2018, 01:09 AM
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If it's difficult to return to center, that is likely actually an issue with negative caster. But yes, that is likely the issue.

It would probably be a good idea to check the casting numbers on the spindles to make sure that they're actually off of a Mustang of your car's year. Spindles can get trashed when wheel bearings go bad, and people frequently replace them with random other spindles from random other years / models for reasons I can't fathom. Might be that by replacing your old parts with correct parts, you've introduced a mismatch between other parts that were wrong to begin with.

There's a procedure listed in the FSM for adjusting the steering box as well and it's a good one to pursue. And I'm fairly sure that the power steering boxes take grease the same as the manual boxes - in which case, you should pump it full.


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post #5 of 8 (permalink) Old 02-26-2018, 01:43 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by WeTheNorth View Post
I had a heck of a time getting the inner drivers side tie rod out. Even with a compressed air pickle fork. Looking at old rod assembly (inner+outer) for reference, I think the PO had the tie rod installed into the spindle from the Top - which I believe is incorrect. I didn't notice it while i was removing it, but when I tried to see how the old one went it, the orientation of the rod ends led me to believe that it's the only way he could have had it. As a result, I had to eyeball the center position of the wheel, and pretty much had to shorten both DS rod ends to their limits to keep it straight. This is why I'm hoping it's an alignment issue.
The outer tie rods attach to the spindle from the bottom with the nut/cotter pin at the top.

You should try to get both tie rods as close as possible to being the same length. Things might be different with a power steering car due to the funky shape of the tie rod on the driver side. Don't just adjust one end of a tie rod without adjusting the other. You want to use the adjusting sleeve between the two to keep them pretty much even.



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post #6 of 8 (permalink) Old 02-26-2018, 01:45 AM Thread Starter
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Evil twin - Thanks. I am planning on doing the greasing. The washer is a good idea.

Kelly_H - That makes sense. I've noticed all kinds of weird workarounds with this car so it's definitely in the realm of possibility. I will look at that. Great advice.
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post #7 of 8 (permalink) Old 02-26-2018, 08:46 AM
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Your current issue sounds like adjustments, so hopefully you can get that dialed in, The only thing I was going to add was the importance of filling the steering gearbox with grease....plan on a whole tube if you haven't done it yet...hit the search feature on the forum.
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post #8 of 8 (permalink) Old 02-26-2018, 10:04 AM
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Iíd highly recommend getting the shop manual. It extensively covers the steering and how to adjust and center the steering wheel. Itís really a valuable book to have

The lack of return can be several things. Generally you need about 5* positive caster for the wheels to return. Youíre not going to nearly get anywhere near that much in stock form. Itís done artificially between the rubber bushing in the idler arm and the control valve in the drag link. Itís possible that the control valve isnít working correctly. Never, ever remove the drag link from the pitman arm with a pickle fork. This will damage the valve. I donít think that is your case. More then likely itís due to lack of alignment. Definitely the new parts arenít helping at this point since theyíre new and very tight. With a good alignment that has a couple degrees of caster and the new parts break in you should be fine. I donít think youíre going to get too much more then about 2* positive caster, maybe 3.

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