Fragola fuel line fittings are made by the devil - Vintage Mustang Forums
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post #1 of 16 (permalink) Old 02-28-2019, 01:58 AM Thread Starter
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Fragola fuel line fittings are made by the devil

It's been a couple of years since I last messed with fuel lines, and apparently I had forgotten this.

I'm exactly one fitting away from having Jane ready to rock. One single, 45*-angle, -6AN female PTFE fuel line fitting away. So I order a very nice-looking Fragola fitting that fits that description. It arrives and something kind of jiggles in the back of my mind but I'm not sure what.

I go to install it on the end of the line. It goes on hard, so I pull it off after turning a single thread on and it is full of metal shavings already.
I clean it back up and throw some more lubricant in there on both sides of the fitting.
I start tightening it again and it starts making metal shavings again.
I pull it back off.
I notice that the collar is not pulling up over the ferrule appropriately, making it so only a thread or two can engage on the fittings before they are doing heavy duty work compressing the ferrule and hose together while being tightened. Alarm bells are ringing in my head.
I try to pull the collar further up the fitting over the ferrule. Mostly, I fail.
I pull the collar back and trim the braided steel hose over the PTFE inner liner so that less of it is sandwiched between the ferrule and the collar.
I reinstall the collar and throw some more lubricant on there.
I start to put the fitting together. It seems to be going much easier this time. I am hopeful.
The fitting then strips out.

I finally remember that I have had trouble with this exact fitting before in the past... and pull out my box of destroyed Fragola fittings, which I have just remembered about. And yeah, there was already an identical fitting in there.


I really, really hate Fragola fittings and I'm really, really (not) glad that I remembered this AFTER buying them. Ugh!

Another order in with Summit to get some steel Aeroquip fittings... don't know why Earls or Summit brand isn't available in a 45* fitting but it's driving me up the wall.

Please consider this your PSA to not use Fragola fittings, but especially not the 45* angle ones which are for some reason made of thinner paper than the rest.


Calamity Jane 1966 Modified Fastback - Driven semi-daily!
Wrecked and rebuilt even better
289 v8, 4-speed, 3.25 9" rear, goodies and stuff.

See my travel blog here for my adventures: http://mapandamustang.blogspot.com/
Over 50,000 miles of North American roads driven on road trips since 2014. More always in the works - stay tuned!

When I show up at a car show and my car is covered in mud, it's probably because I drove 2000 miles to get there
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post #2 of 16 (permalink) Old 02-28-2019, 03:23 AM
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I've never had issues running their stuff. Also, are you sure Summit doesn't sell 45* fittings. Pretty sure mine is currently all Summit fittings, and pretty sure I have several 45* pieces (albeit, in nickel -8an).


1969 MaCh 1 - CHP 427w 10.8 comp
460 rwhp / 489 rwtq SAE

TFS 205cc 11R heads || Vic Jr. intake || Holley 950HP || 14" 6 piston / 13" 4 piston Wilwood brakes || T56 Magnum || SPEC 2+ hyd clutch || Detroit Locker || 3.70's || Aluminum DS || TCP R&P || TCP 1 1/8" front sway bar || TCP front adj coilover's || TCP Panhard Rod & rear sway bar || Maier rear leafs || Bilstein shocks || Forgeline GA3C wheels - 18"×10", 19"x12" 325/30
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post #3 of 16 (permalink) Old 02-28-2019, 03:34 AM Thread Starter
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You know, I was quite sure until about 30 seconds ago, when I changed my search terms from "-6 an 45 fitting" to "-6 an 45 hose end" and all the sudden the right one popped up

The issue is the Fragola fittings made for the PTFE line. I never had any trouble with the fittings made for plain braided SS, possibly because it was easier to work with as rubber deforms and is a little more forgiving. But man their PTFE fittings just suck.

I've had really good luck with the Summit PTFE fittings in anondized aluminum, and of course have had no issues at all with any brand in steel/nickel. Another buyer did a comparison somewhere of the Summit fittings vs. the Fragola fittings and showed that the Summit fittings had a few more threads than the Fragola fittings, which allowed them to go together much more easily without stripping.


Calamity Jane 1966 Modified Fastback - Driven semi-daily!
Wrecked and rebuilt even better
289 v8, 4-speed, 3.25 9" rear, goodies and stuff.

See my travel blog here for my adventures: http://mapandamustang.blogspot.com/
Over 50,000 miles of North American roads driven on road trips since 2014. More always in the works - stay tuned!

When I show up at a car show and my car is covered in mud, it's probably because I drove 2000 miles to get there
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post #4 of 16 (permalink) Old 02-28-2019, 06:00 AM
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Are you using the Fragola PTFE line with the plastic coating on the outside? If so, that coating must be removed prior to assembling the fitting. I've never had a problem with Fragola, and since I've moved away from the left coast, that's all I use. I used to use XRP, but can't find them here in the swamp.

John

The Fauxstang. Dynacorn 67 fastback. Dart SHP 363, Close ratio Magnum 6 speed, 3.70 Eaton Truetrac in a fabricated full floater 9", SorT coil over suspension. Still in pieces.
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post #5 of 16 (permalink) Old 02-28-2019, 09:55 AM
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Seems like I remember a thread a few weeks ago where everyone was praising how awesome Fragola fittings are. I have several Earl’s fittings on my car and they really are awesome. In fact, I’ve just ordered several more.

Regards,
Patrick
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post #6 of 16 (permalink) Old 02-28-2019, 09:55 AM Thread Starter
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Nope, no coating on the hose, just the standard.

Unfortunately Summit's fittings seem to be back-ordered for a couple of weeks, so I guess I'll give the Aeroquip a whirl. Hopefully it works fine with the Fragola PTFE hose. I know the Summit fittings do.


Calamity Jane 1966 Modified Fastback - Driven semi-daily!
Wrecked and rebuilt even better
289 v8, 4-speed, 3.25 9" rear, goodies and stuff.

See my travel blog here for my adventures: http://mapandamustang.blogspot.com/
Over 50,000 miles of North American roads driven on road trips since 2014. More always in the works - stay tuned!

When I show up at a car show and my car is covered in mud, it's probably because I drove 2000 miles to get there
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post #7 of 16 (permalink) Old 02-28-2019, 12:06 PM
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In a previous life I worked for Aeroquip (now Eaton) designing hoses and fittings for the Aerospace industry. Military standards are pretty exacting. I've never used any Aeroquip automotive fittings, but I'm sure they are the same.

69 Mach 1, 351W, T5, owned for 31 years, 03 Mach 1 Azure Blue, 65 fastback, 289, C4 (son's), 67 fastback, 289, C4 (wife's)
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post #8 of 16 (permalink) Old 02-28-2019, 01:26 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kelly_H View Post
You know, I was quite sure until about 30 seconds ago, when I changed my search terms from "-6 an 45 fitting" to "-6 an 45 hose end" and all the sudden the right one popped up

The issue is the Fragola fittings made for the PTFE line. I never had any trouble with the fittings made for plain braided SS, possibly because it was easier to work with as rubber deforms and is a little more forgiving. But man their PTFE fittings just suck.

I've had really good luck with the Summit PTFE fittings in anondized aluminum, and of course have had no issues at all with any brand in steel/nickel. Another buyer did a comparison somewhere of the Summit fittings vs. the Fragola fittings and showed that the Summit fittings had a few more threads than the Fragola fittings, which allowed them to go together much more easily without stripping.
Have you tried talking to Fragola about the problem? They are good people and are very responsive to issues with their products. They might even revise the product based on your feedback.

"We've always done it that way" - the most dangerous words ever spoken

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post #9 of 16 (permalink) Old 02-28-2019, 01:45 PM
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I just did like 12 of them a few weeks ago. I ran into the stripping of the threads issue on one of them and it was my fault. I had too much braid exposed and it got in the threads.
Other than that, they went on pretty easily. All 12 in the car w/ no leaks. This was with Fragola stainless braid. I've run into issues in the past mixing and matching hose with fittings.

I'm not sure if you did or not but, it's a good practice to use the same hose brand as fittings.
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post #10 of 16 (permalink) Old 02-28-2019, 01:58 PM Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by Hemikiller View Post
Have you tried talking to Fragola about the problem? They are good people and are very responsive to issues with their products. They might even revise the product based on your feedback.
Yep, shot them an email describing the problem and telling them that I found a number of reviews on the Summit website with the same problem.

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Originally Posted by chaser012001 View Post
I just did like 12 of them a few weeks ago. I ran into the stripping of the threads issue on one of them and it was my fault. I had too much braid exposed and it got in the threads.
Other than that, they went on pretty easily. All 12 in the car w/ no leaks. This was with Fragola stainless braid. I've run into issues in the past mixing and matching hose with fittings.

I'm not sure if you did or not but, it's a good practice to use the same hose brand as fittings.
Were you using the stainless braid with the rubber core, or the PTFE? I haven't had any issues with the rubber-cored stainless braided lines in the past, so no complaints there. I only started running into issues with Fragola when I swapped to PTFE. Yes, I have matched their PTFE line to their PTFE fittings so it is not a brand-mismatch issue.

I cut back the braid significantly to try to get the collar to fit better so that more threads were exposed, but I think it is an issue with the shape of the collar. Got to the point where I was afraid to cut back any more of the braid because it would no longer be contacting the ferrule.

Ironically, the Summit fittings work perfectly with the Fragola hose.


Calamity Jane 1966 Modified Fastback - Driven semi-daily!
Wrecked and rebuilt even better
289 v8, 4-speed, 3.25 9" rear, goodies and stuff.

See my travel blog here for my adventures: http://mapandamustang.blogspot.com/
Over 50,000 miles of North American roads driven on road trips since 2014. More always in the works - stay tuned!

When I show up at a car show and my car is covered in mud, it's probably because I drove 2000 miles to get there
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post #11 of 16 (permalink) Old 02-28-2019, 02:31 PM
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I always use a little of the Mobil 1 synthetic chassis grease on the fitting threads, it seems to stay in place and lube a little better than oil.
Did your fittings have the “olive” that goes between the PTFE and the braid? The "Real Street" series 6000 PTFE hose requires the 6000 series hose ends.

John

The Fauxstang. Dynacorn 67 fastback. Dart SHP 363, Close ratio Magnum 6 speed, 3.70 Eaton Truetrac in a fabricated full floater 9", SorT coil over suspension. Still in pieces.
'14 SHO with most all the bells and whistles. Stock for now.
F-150 SCab daily driver
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post #12 of 16 (permalink) Old 02-28-2019, 02:38 PM
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May not be the issue, but I try not to mix-and-match hose and fitting suppliers. Not all SS hose is identical, and IIRC some fittings state only to be used with a specific type of hose. I've never had to trim back the braid or do anything weird, just a square cut with a cutoff wheel and assemble.

'65 A-code coupe, T-10 4-speed, 8" 3.25 limited slip

Last edited by stephen_wilson; 02-28-2019 at 02:41 PM.
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post #13 of 16 (permalink) Old 02-28-2019, 02:56 PM
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Yep, shot them an email describing the problem and telling them that I found a number of reviews on the Summit website with the same problem.



Were you using the stainless braid with the rubber core, or the PTFE?

I cut back the braid significantly to try to get the collar to fit better so that more threads were exposed, but I think it is an issue with the shape of the collar. Got to the point where I was afraid to cut back any more of the braid because it would no longer be contacting the ferrule.

Ironically, the Summit fittings work perfectly with the Fragola hose.

PTFE hose. Like i said, i had one that stripped out and I was super annoyed at it. I bought extras though (after reading similar reviews to the stripping out) so it wasnt the end of the world.
I'm surprised I didnt have leaks tbh but I'll take it.

One thing I remember that was kind of strange was that there wasnt really a common 'resistance' or feel in each one I put together which I thought was a little strange. I had some that would spin together no problem (i figured these would leak) and others that fought me tooth and nail. /shrug

You'll get it sorted out though. You're pretty good at this stuff.
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post #14 of 16 (permalink) Old 02-28-2019, 03:38 PM
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After fighting and fighting and fighting an fitting install on steel braided lines for an offroad race truck years around I started doing a bit of research why my hands were all trashed from endless poking yet on youtube everyone makes it looks so easy! What I found is not all hoses are the same. Some have a slightly different OD or ID then the next. If you use hose supplied by the same manufacturer as the fittings I'm finding it's ALWAYS an easy install! Mixing and matching brands though... Ugh, sometimes it seems virtually impossible to get them together! Ever since that first truck plumb I've made a point to buy matching brand stuff and it's been night and day easier ever since. Just my first hand 2 cents...
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post #15 of 16 (permalink) Old 02-28-2019, 08:49 PM
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After fighting and fighting and fighting an fitting install on steel braided lines for an offroad race truck years around I started doing a bit of research why my hands were all trashed from endless poking yet on youtube everyone makes it looks so easy! What I found is not all hoses are the same. Some have a slightly different OD or ID then the next. If you use hose supplied by the same manufacturer as the fittings I'm finding it's ALWAYS an easy install! Mixing and matching brands though... Ugh, sometimes it seems virtually impossible to get them together! Ever since that first truck plumb I've made a point to buy matching brand stuff and it's been night and day easier ever since. Just my first hand 2 cents...
Using the proper tool always helps. I had problems before, but these make it really simple. Expensive for such a simple tool, but worth it.
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1969 MaCh 1 - CHP 427w 10.8 comp
460 rwhp / 489 rwtq SAE

TFS 205cc 11R heads || Vic Jr. intake || Holley 950HP || 14" 6 piston / 13" 4 piston Wilwood brakes || T56 Magnum || SPEC 2+ hyd clutch || Detroit Locker || 3.70's || Aluminum DS || TCP R&P || TCP 1 1/8" front sway bar || TCP front adj coilover's || TCP Panhard Rod & rear sway bar || Maier rear leafs || Bilstein shocks || Forgeline GA3C wheels - 18"×10", 19"x12" 325/30
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