Dino results on my 302 with Edelbrock 2091 kit - Page 3 - Vintage Mustang Forums
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post #31 of 41 (permalink) Old 03-11-2019, 03:03 PM
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For the cost of the carb and future dyno time, you could have installed a Holley Sniper EFI.
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post #32 of 41 (permalink) Old 03-11-2019, 03:07 PM
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And still needed to tune that setup.....

As the drill sergeant said, "I taught you everything you know. I didn't teach you everything I know."

"Human beings, who are almost unique in having the ability to learn from the experience of others, are also remarkable for their apparent disinclination to do so."
- Douglas Adams
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post #33 of 41 (permalink) Old 03-11-2019, 04:42 PM
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I didn't tune my holly sniper... I just did the self learn and it started right up gets 18mpg highway. Runs fine.. Was I supposed to tune it lol?
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post #34 of 41 (permalink) Old 03-11-2019, 05:33 PM
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And still needed to tune that setup.....
Exactly.
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post #35 of 41 (permalink) Old 03-11-2019, 08:10 PM
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I didn't tune my holly sniper... I just did the self learn and it started right up gets 18mpg highway. Runs fine.. Was I supposed to tune it lol?

The self learning software will get you on the ball field but an expert in a dyno shop with a lap top will hit the home run. That is a simplistic analogy but basically true. The learning mode software will hold everything on the conservative side and the engine will run fine. It just won't run to its true potential if it was built significantly above a stock engine. If it is stock to slightly modified the self learning tune will probably work fine and there's not really any need to get the lap top out.


For Edelbrock to get that up to 367 on the engine dyno they pulled out every trick. They will run cold air directly into the carb, over sized headers like probably 1 3/4 long tubes on the advertised set up, racing fuel and as much timing as it will stand with racing fuel. They also probably ran a 0 altitude correction so they could call it 367 but the only place you could ever potentially see that would be at sea level somewhere. They will also run thinner than the recommended oil, no alternator and drive the water pump mechanically. None of those tricks are realistic for somebody that is buying the kit but that is what they do to get the advertised number.


65 2+2, 331, C4 presently apart for complete a restore
1979 Ford F150 custom, 302, C4, AC, tilt wheel, main transportation

Last edited by macstang; 03-11-2019 at 08:16 PM.
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post #36 of 41 (permalink) Old 03-11-2019, 09:27 PM
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Originally Posted by macstang View Post
For Edelbrock to get that up to 367 on the engine dyno they pulled out every trick. They will run cold air directly into the carb, over sized headers like probably 1 3/4 long tubes on the advertised set up, racing fuel and as much timing as it will stand with racing fuel. They also probably ran a 0 altitude correction so they could call it 367 but the only place you could ever potentially see that would be at sea level somewhere. They will also run thinner than the recommended oil, no alternator and drive the water pump mechanically. None of those tricks are realistic for somebody that is buying the kit but that is what they do to get the advertised number.
I believe that pull from edlebrock made the power at 6500 rpm. that would be about a VE of ~100% for a 302 which seems to be inline with what I've seen. The 340 ft-lbs out of a 302 with 9.5 compression is only 1.12 ft-lbs/ci. I would call that very conservative. So I don't personally think they were doing anything funny. I believe STD correction is for 0 altitude. It's probably the most common correction standard besides the SAE.

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post #37 of 41 (permalink) Old 03-12-2019, 02:41 AM
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Originally Posted by macstang View Post
The self learning software will get you on the ball field but an expert in a dyno shop with a lap top will hit the home run. That is a simplistic analogy but basically true. The learning mode software will hold everything on the conservative side and the engine will run fine. It just won't run to its true potential if it was built significantly above a stock engine. If it is stock to slightly modified the self learning tune will probably work fine and there's not really any need to get the lap top out.


For Edelbrock to get that up to 367 on the engine dyno they pulled out every trick. They will run cold air directly into the carb, over sized headers like probably 1 3/4 long tubes on the advertised set up, racing fuel and as much timing as it will stand with racing fuel. They also probably ran a 0 altitude correction so they could call it 367 but the only place you could ever potentially see that would be at sea level somewhere. They will also run thinner than the recommended oil, no alternator and drive the water pump mechanically. None of those tricks are realistic for somebody that is buying the kit but that is what they do to get the advertised number.
Basically what I believe as well.


That said, those cylinder heads with similar conservative combos (ie "package") on the old 87-93 5.0's would see about 275-280rwhp through a T5 manual. The AOD's were another 20-30rwhp less. Not bad at all, but the TFS and AFR headed combos that were better sorted in selected parts were seeing 305-310rwhp through a T5. A stock 5.0 HO through a T5 is typically in the 190-195rwhp range while the AOD's were in the 170rwhp range, for reference. These rwhp numbers are off of a DynoJet with SAE correction factor.

I'm still wondering what type of dyno this was run on. Theres a chance this thing isn't as badly tuned as it seems and the results are skewed due to the dyno itself, but the OP has provided very little info.


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TFS 205cc 11R heads || Vic Jr. intake || Holley 950HP || 14" 6 piston / 13" 4 piston Wilwood brakes || T56 Magnum || SPEC 2+ hyd clutch || Detroit Locker || 3.70's || Aluminum DS || TCP R&P || TCP 1 1/8" front sway bar || TCP front adj coilover's || TCP Panhard Rod & rear sway bar || Maier rear leafs || Bilstein shocks || Forgeline GA3C wheels - 18"10", 19"x12" 325/30

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post #38 of 41 (permalink) Old 03-12-2019, 08:14 AM
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And still needed to tune that setup.....
True, but lets face it, lots of people just run a carb out-of-the-box. I did when I was 19. Any of the EFI kits will be miles better than that.

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post #39 of 41 (permalink) Old 03-12-2019, 09:13 AM
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post #40 of 41 (permalink) Old 03-12-2019, 10:25 AM
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Originally Posted by 66slvrpny View Post
I had the same experience with my build once it hit the dyno. I would suggest bringing it to a tune shop they will get the most out of what you have. Get that c4 out of there and swap in a 4r70w trans. I am finishing up my swap now. faster 1st and 2nd gear and you have overdrive. Here is my motor.

Original 289ci block with stock crank and connecting rods
Bored .40 over, aluminum pistons, fully balanced rotating assembly.
Edelbrock E-Street 60cc aluminum cylinder heads (milled to 54cc to bring combustion up to 9.8) with Scorpion Racing full roller rockers and ARP head studs.
Edelbrock Performer flat tappet cam and lifters Duration 270/280, Lift .448/.472
Edelbrock 289 Performer intake manifold
Edelbrock 500 cfm carburetor
Edelbrock Performer mecanical fuel pump.
Patriot Full-Length try-y ceramic coated headers with2.25 inch duel exaust with magnaflow mufflers.

My car hit 212hp at the wheels. I am hoping to to improve these numbers though by changing cam and carb. best of luck on your car


What carb are you going with after the 500??
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post #41 of 41 (permalink) Old 03-16-2019, 05:19 PM
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What carb are you going with after the 500??
A Holly 650 would be probably the max to match up with the rest of my set up. it the end there is only so much power you can pull out of a 289. But it still is a very fun car!
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