Hedman Headers, should I be concerned with heat - Vintage Mustang Forums
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post #1 of 15 (permalink) Old 03-25-2019, 12:28 AM Thread Starter
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Hedman Headers, should I be concerned with heat

My engine install is starting to go together at the shop. As I expected, there are some clearance issues that have to be addressed.
I have read on here about a few people having issues with either their steering boxes getting damaged or the risk of the master cylinder boiling up the brake fluid and damaging the innards.
My install already required a hammer being taken to the next to last tube, as it turns down, on the drivers side just to get clearance on the brake booster. My shop decided to go with a different booster that will sit higher and give a bit of clearance.
We discussed putting in a heat shield over the MC and booster to protect it.
Looking at this picture makes me concerned about the effects of the heat on the steering box.
I plan to take this car on some long drives. Northern AZ from Phoenix and to Cali on occasion.
Thoughts? Other options to discuss with the builder.
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post #2 of 15 (permalink) Old 03-25-2019, 06:14 AM
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Of course you should be concerned about heat. As I recall, my 5.0 Mountaineer had factory headers, and they had heat shields on them. You should probably consider wrapping your headers.


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post #3 of 15 (permalink) Old 03-25-2019, 06:42 PM Thread Starter
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Of course you should be concerned about heat. As I recall, my 5.0 Mountaineer had factory headers, and they had heat shields on them. You should probably consider wrapping your headers.

After reading some threads on heat wrap, I have some reservations about using it on the entire header. From what I understand, it can lead to premature destruction of the header and it seems the companies will void the warranty if used.
Possibly wrapping just the affected pipes would be adequate. I have seen some other products that just partially wrap the header and is also heat shield material.

Many have suggested ceramic coating the headers. Anyone have any idea on cost?
It would need to be done asap before the engine is built up to the point of no return.

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post #4 of 15 (permalink) Old 03-25-2019, 07:14 PM
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Mine is a manual box but it got hot with the header tube blasting away on it. I was concerned about it cooking off the grease inside the box so I did this. It actually came out looking better than I expected.





That is HP heat shield. After I got it completely wrapped I sprayed it with a metal grey coating to cover the shiney. I didn't like the shiney. It seems to be working well so far but I haven't run out on the highway for 30 or 40 miles with the car yet.



I also discovered Eastwoods high heat header coating which is the best I have tried so far so I cleaned and sprayed 3 coats of it on my headers. The level of heat they put off is significantly less than the VHT I have traditionally sprayed. I have heat cycled the engine a bunch of times now and it doesn't show any hint of trying to come off but I cleaned the heck out of my header pipes. I'm running 1 5/8ths Hooker super comps which I have thought were the worst fitting headers that exist. Mine have "customizing" on certain tubes on both sides. I am trying to avoid wrapping my headers too. So far I haven't.



The thing I haven't figured out yet is how to blanket the underside of my fiberglass hood. I've called a bunch of places and they won't commit to their product staying put. I haven't done anything so far but the hood isn't back on the car yet.


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Last edited by macstang; 03-25-2019 at 07:24 PM.
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post #5 of 15 (permalink) Old 03-25-2019, 08:41 PM
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I just sent the Hedman headers for the 5.0 in my 66 to Specialized Performance Coating in Arlington, Texas. I've used them in a number of projects with excellent results. They coat headers inside and out which really helps with radiated heat.
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post #6 of 15 (permalink) Old 03-25-2019, 09:53 PM
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Yeh you're going to need something to reduce the heat. I have a 302 with JBA ceramic coated shorty headers and the grease cooks out of my steering box. I had to install fiberglass spark plug boots to keep the wires from getting burnt. When I first broke in the engine the headers turned cherry red. I never realized how much heat these things can put off.

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post #7 of 15 (permalink) Old 03-25-2019, 11:41 PM Thread Starter
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@macstang

Your car was the one I referring to in my original post. Got me worried for sure.

@Mac-427 Thanks for the input. How much did the coating cost? I see that there are brush and spray on ceramic coatings on Summit, just don't know how effective they are compared to a professional doing it.

@Moodster , it is crazy that even ceramic coated ones throw off that much heat. Have you had steering issues on longer drives?

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post #8 of 15 (permalink) Old 03-26-2019, 05:38 AM
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[QUOTE=67CustomStang;10132564]@macstang

Your car was the one I referring to in my original post. Got me worried for sure.

@Mac-427 Thanks for the input. How much did the coating cost? I see that there are brush and spray on ceramic coatings on Summit, just don't know how effective they are compared to a professional doing it.

Mine are costing me $245 inside and out. He's doing them in bright silver but there are other hues as well. I had a restored 69 Camaro with stock manifolds done in cast iron by Specialized Performance Coating that couldn't be told from stock. I had previously tried Eastwood cast iron paint on those and they rusted over time so I decided no more paint. Spend the cash and let the professionals do the job.
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post #9 of 15 (permalink) Old 03-26-2019, 10:29 AM Thread Starter
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[quote=Mac-427;10132618]
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Originally Posted by 67CustomStang View Post
@macstang

Your car was the one I referring to in my original post. Got me worried for sure.

@Mac-427 Thanks for the input. How much did the coating cost? I see that there are brush and spray on ceramic coatings on Summit, just don't know how effective they are compared to a professional doing it.

Mine are costing me $245 inside and out. He's doing them in bright silver but there are other hues as well. I had a restored 69 Camaro with stock manifolds done in cast iron by Specialized Performance Coating that couldn't be told from stock. I had previously tried Eastwood cast iron paint on those and they rusted over time so I decided no more paint. Spend the cash and let the professionals do the job.
Thanks for the info I'm meeting with the restorer tomorrow. I'll bring it up.

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post #10 of 15 (permalink) Old 03-26-2019, 11:23 AM
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+1 on ceramic coating. I had a CTS-V that I turned into a track car and bumped up horsepower and handling. I put a set of Kooks headers on and had them coated. I was REALLY impressed with the heat rejection and under hood temps were pretty good IMO. And this was a supercharged engine that I flogged mercilessly. I also do not recommend header wrap if you are leaving it on long-term as it will deteriorate the headers over time.

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post #11 of 15 (permalink) Old 03-26-2019, 12:07 PM
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On the other hand you could stick with manual brakes. They’re really not that bad. I’m using a 1” piston with front discs.
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post #12 of 15 (permalink) Old 03-26-2019, 02:15 PM
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I put power discs on my 68. A kit from (SSBC). Drove it for a while, then put in a T5 with a cable for clutch linkage. It interfered with the booster. I went back to manual, same pads and calipers. I didn't notice a difference.
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post #13 of 15 (permalink) Old 03-26-2019, 02:47 PM
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My old '82 F100 came with manual brakes. My 110 pound wife used to drive it sometimes. Among the numerous things she would complain about, the brakes weren't ever one. I even asked once and she said she had failed to notice any issue. I took that to mean if I could get the engineering balance right I didn't need power brakes in my ever so much lighter Mustangs either.

Same wife DOES notice (complains) and prefers power rack and pinion over power gear box steering. Say gearbox steering feels loose and sloppy. I've discovered I tend to self-adjust to the point I don't notice such much any more. Test drove a man's truck to check out how it was running the other day and when I came back he said "Pulls to the right pretty bad, doesn't it?" I hemmed and hawed a few seconds until realized that I had immediately noticed that and had been automatically wrestling it into a straight line the whole drive without consciously thinking about it. So it may be I'm not the best one to recommend tastes in driving experience.
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post #14 of 15 (permalink) Old 04-25-2019, 02:37 AM Thread Starter
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Here's a quick update.
We decided to have the headers coated inside and out with ceramic. Used a nice silver color, looks great.
The brake booster was changed to a different one that is not as deep. Much better clearance and the MC doesn't sit anywhere near the shock tower now. We will put a small heat shield near the MC and borgeson box to give some added protection, but I feel more confident now that there is ceramic on those headers.
Thank you all for your input.
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post #15 of 15 (permalink) Old 04-25-2019, 11:44 AM
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I don't have discs yet but I can instantly lock up the drums without much effort. If I got power brakes wouldn't they lock up even quicker with less pedal effort?

As far as header heat...

You can reduce the heat if your car is tuned properly. Not talking about idle, WOT, tip-in / transient response- those are all easier to tune based on engine behavior. It's cruise that is a bit more elusive. Most of us aren't running around with a wideband but I bet a lot of us would be pretty surprised at how lean our tune is while cruising. This is where our engines live and if you're running a little lean at cruise it may not hurt anything but it sure produces a lot of exhaust heat, not to mention it taxes the cooling system.

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