Shelby drop, like or dislike - Vintage Mustang Forums
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post #1 of 66 (permalink) Old 08-21-2019, 02:47 PM Thread Starter
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Shelby drop, like or dislike

so i did the shelby drop and gt springs on the wifes 66 when i rebuilt the front end, every thing is new and i replaced all the ps components as well, all from chockstang.
i printed off the alignment specks and all was good on the print out.
I'm just not happy with the way it drives, i cant really give you a specific reason, other than the steering wheel does not return to center, but i just dont care for how it feels, maybe you could call it heavy feeling. i fully know that these wont drive like a new car. anyone else not digging the way it drives after you have done the shelby drop
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post #2 of 66 (permalink) Old 08-21-2019, 02:51 PM
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I have done it on my 69Coupe but I have yet to drive it so I can not comment on how it feels. I also replaced everything in the F/e & went with the roller idler arm & manual steering.

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post #3 of 66 (permalink) Old 08-21-2019, 02:56 PM
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I feel confident in saying that whatever it is you donít like about it now, the drop is not the cause. The fact that it no longer returning to center points to some problem with the alignment or something else.

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post #4 of 66 (permalink) Old 08-21-2019, 03:17 PM
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Since everything is new the ball joints are still really stiff that's probably part of the issue. You really need about 5į positive caster to make the steering wheel return. Otherwise it's artificially done with the idler arm bushing or PS control valve. Give it some time.

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post #5 of 66 (permalink) Old 08-21-2019, 03:27 PM
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I can't imagine how you can have " heavy" steering with power steering Do you have an Idler with a bearing our stock rubber bushing
The UCA drop was one of the best things I did to my car ,Very happy with it
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post #6 of 66 (permalink) Old 08-21-2019, 03:37 PM
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Did the alignment shop use the figures from Opentracker? As already suggested on this thread increased caster is your friend for both self-centring and stability.

My car was transformed for the better by the Arning drop and a good alignment, I hope yours will be too.
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post #7 of 66 (permalink) Old 08-21-2019, 03:45 PM
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Previous owner did the drop in my fastback, It drove OK but when I needed to get an alignment done, I converted back to the OEM holes and I believe it drives better.
To be honest, I couldn't pick any difference in handling at all. My car is driven on Sundays, not on a track.

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post #8 of 66 (permalink) Old 08-21-2019, 03:47 PM
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The control arm drop only improves the non existent camber curve. You need more caster or something is dragging in the power steering or not quite right there. Since you say the steering is heavy then the issue is most likely there. Could be anything from a pitman shaft overcenter adjustment too tight to something in the PS valving. I have more experience with saginaw steering gears and pumps but it's all the same unless you have the stock system then all bets are off as I have always stayed away from those style systems.
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post #9 of 66 (permalink) Old 08-21-2019, 03:54 PM
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What specs did you use for alignment? The drop changes your roll center and your camber as the suspension goes through its travel. It's not responsible for your steering 'feel', really, except that it does improve your tires' ability to stay flat on the pavement and not roll over like it did with the original mounts. I'd bet dimes to dollars you need more caster for your PS, to help with return-to-center. At least 5 if you can get it.


The drop is one of the best things I ever did to my car besides drive it.

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post #10 of 66 (permalink) Old 08-21-2019, 04:14 PM
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My '65 fb has it, my '65 coupe doesn't. The coupe seems to handle fine as it's driven like a normal car. The fb handles differently, but I also flog the dogsh*t out of it when I drive it. I think it all depends on how you will drive the car. On a side note, doing the drop in a 65-6 that has a 351W in it is no fun!! The stock upper control arm bolts are too long and hit the headers on both of my cars. I ended up cutting off the bolts for clearance, then had to go back and replace them with new ones... and cut them off a little shorter after shims were installed! PITA

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post #11 of 66 (permalink) Old 08-21-2019, 04:42 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by elcam84 View Post
The control arm drop only improves the non existent camber curve. You need more caster or something is dragging in the power steering or not quite right there. Since you say the steering is heavy then the issue is most likely there. Could be anything from a pitman shaft overcenter adjustment too tight to something in the PS valving. I have more experience with saginaw steering gears and pumps but it's all the same unless you have the stock system then all bets are off as I have always stayed away from those style systems.
The camber curve on a stocker is hardly non existent..... it rolls massively into positive camber gain when
going through turns.

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post #12 of 66 (permalink) Old 08-21-2019, 04:44 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by whitey68 View Post
so i did the shelby drop and gt springs on the wifes 66 when i rebuilt the front end, every thing is new and i replaced all the ps components as well, all from chockstang.
i printed off the alignment specks and all was good on the print out.
I'm just not happy with the way it drives, i cant really give you a specific reason, other than the steering wheel does not return to center, but i just dont care for how it feels, maybe you could call it heavy feeling. i fully know that these wont drive like a new car. anyone else not digging the way it drives after you have done the shelby drop
thanks man
jeff
I'm guessing your alignment is not even close to appropriate for running the Arning drop.

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post #13 of 66 (permalink) Old 08-21-2019, 05:02 PM
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Well, even the stock geometry has a camber curve, but the gain is not nearly enough to compensate for the body roll. Only ~0,3 deg per degree of body roll, IIRC. That means that if the body rolls 4 degrees, the tires will be tilted ~3 degrees. With the Shelby drop, the ratio is about 0,7 deg of camber change per degree of body roll, so the wheel camber would only be +1 deg for the same 4 deg of body roll.

You could design a suspension that gives loads of camber gain, but that would result in other negative consequences.
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post #14 of 66 (permalink) Old 08-21-2019, 05:21 PM
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What alignment specs did the shop use? (Note: The original specs that come up on their computer are going to make the car drive weird. Those specs were for a bias ply tire and no Arning Drop.)

On the caster you can offset the upper control arm bar (within its mounts on the control arm. See: https://dazecars.com/dazed/UCA.html) that bolts to the body of the car about 1/8" or a bit more, and then pull the lower control arm forward (if you have aftermarket adjustable strut rods) and then you can get 6 or so degrees of castor and the wheel is still centered in the wheel well.

If you have power steering and the stock rubber idler arm it should return to center, if you have an upgraded roller bearing idler arm it is not going to return to center unless you have a lot of castor dialed in.

On the positive flip side now you can just steer the car where you want it to go.

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post #15 of 66 (permalink) Old 08-21-2019, 05:26 PM
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'67 here and definitely like it compared to before.

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