65 Steering Upgrade - Is this a good idea? - Vintage Mustang Forums
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post #1 of 36 (permalink) Old 08-25-2019, 03:14 AM Thread Starter
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65 Steering Upgrade - Is this a good idea?

I have a 6 cylinder. I am working on upgrading the components to eventually put in a 302. The next step for me is the front suspension brakes and steering. For the suspension I am going to go with Streetortrack's (SoT) coilovers. I am also going to go with Shaun's disc brakes. @Shaun - if you see this please let me know what you think on my proposed setup below.

These upgrades require a spindle upgrade and while I am at it, I plan on replacing the steering. Here is what I think I am going to go with:

* Ididit tilt steering column and EPAS from stangaholics link
* New quick steer steering box from SoT Link
* Shelby roller quick steer idler and pitman from SoT Link
* Big spindles from SoT Link

The goal with the car is to create a fun daily driver with great handling. I am inexperienced and learning as I go.

Will this setup work? Is there something else I should consider? Thanks in advance for any help.
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post #2 of 36 (permalink) Old 08-25-2019, 05:23 AM
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If going to a V8, you're going to need to reinforce the body structure, including torque boxes on all four corners, and upgrade the rear axle to at least an 8". You will also need to upgrade the brakes and change to 5 lug wheels.
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post #3 of 36 (permalink) Old 08-25-2019, 10:19 AM
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you might give serious consideration to just having the Ford steering box rebuilt / restored by Chock:

Classic Mustang Disc Brake Conversions and Power Steering

the price is reasonable, the results outstanding.

.....an opinion I share with many VFM'ers is that the modern replacement steering boxes have NOWHERE the quality of parts and metallurgy when compared to the original Ford boxes. You don't need a new steering box, and having one is not going to give you any better steering quality than Chock's restored boxes.

Z.

PS another GREAT vendor is John @ Opentracker:
https://opentrackerracing.com/index.html

He will ALWAYS have time to talk to you and LISTEN to your goals, not just sell you what's on "sale". His prices are competitive with everyone, and often you can find the identical part on the Opentracker web site, for the same or less $$$. Plus you get the suburb Opentracker customer service, which no one can match, imho.
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Last edited by zray; 08-25-2019 at 10:23 AM.
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post #4 of 36 (permalink) Old 08-25-2019, 11:34 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by zray View Post
you might give serious consideration to just having the Ford steering box rebuilt / restored by Chock:

Classic Mustang Disc Brake Conversions and Power Steering

the price is reasonable, the results outstanding.

.....an opinion I share with many VFM'ers is that the modern replacement steering boxes have NOWHERE the quality of parts and metallurgy when compared to the original Ford boxes. You don't need a new steering box, and having one is not going to give you any better steering quality than Chock's restored boxes.

Z.


I've never posted this info before as it just came to light.....
Should we ever be talking about a Flaming River box, It's been rumored/suggested that the FR internals are
made in Argentina. If this is true, I'm thinking it may be the same place that does worm gears for the aftermarket,
such as for my '48 truck. I returned my Made in Argentina piece and sourced a NOS item because I had read that
these aftermarket Argentine parts were several numbers lower on the Rockwell hardness scale, compared to NOS.
(8 points softer to be exact)

ex-Global West GM
1991-1995
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post #5 of 36 (permalink) Old 08-25-2019, 12:49 PM Thread Starter
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If going to a V8, you're going to need to reinforce the body structure, including torque boxes on all four corners, and upgrade the rear axle to at least an 8". You will also need to upgrade the brakes and change to 5 lug wheels.
Any thoughts on the upgrades I asked about?
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post #6 of 36 (permalink) Old 08-25-2019, 12:50 PM Thread Starter
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you might give serious consideration to just having the Ford steering box rebuilt / restored by Chock:
Will do, thank you.
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post #7 of 36 (permalink) Old 08-25-2019, 12:54 PM Thread Starter
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@Opentracker - do you sell the short Ididit steering column and EPAS? What do you think of the parts I put together?
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post #8 of 36 (permalink) Old 08-25-2019, 04:19 PM
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V8 center link. The bigger outer tie rods come in the disc brake kit. Since you are doing all of this now would be a good time to check your ball joints and upper control arm shafts/bushings. If they are worn/loose/sloppy/out they obviously should be replaced with all this other stuff.


I am not aware that there were any short shaft steering boxes in 65 and 66. Mine and every other one I have seen is an integral long shaft which obviously wouldn't work with the electric steering unit you linked because it uses a knuckle or jointed coupler. Sometimes photos of stuff are generic. I thought the short shaft rag joint coupler type steering box came out in 67. I would find out if the steering unit coupler will connect(as in same splines) to that short shaft steering box.


This is a 65-66 16:1 quick steering box so you can see the question or issue.






65 2+2, 331, C4 presently apart for complete a restore
1979 Ford F150 custom, 302, C4, AC, tilt wheel, main transportation

Last edited by macstang; 08-25-2019 at 04:32 PM.
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post #9 of 36 (permalink) Old 08-25-2019, 04:33 PM Thread Starter
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V8 center link. The bigger outer tie rods come in the disc brake kit. Since you are doing all of this now would be a good time to check your ball joints and upper control arm shafts/bushings. If they are worn/loose/sloppy/out they obviously should be replaced with all this other stuff.
Thank you. I will add a V8 center link to the list.

I think the ball joints and upper control arm shafts/bushings come with the coilover kit... I will make sure to ask.
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post #10 of 36 (permalink) Old 08-25-2019, 04:38 PM Thread Starter
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I am not aware that there were any short shaft steering boxes in 65 and 66. Mine and every other one I have seen is an integral long shaft which obviously wouldn't work with the electric steering unit you linked because it uses a knuckle or jointed coupler.
Based on the EPAS install instructions (Link) I think you are right, but I should be able to cut it down if I am not able to find a steering box with a shortened shaft that will work in the 65 - no idea if they exist or not.
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post #11 of 36 (permalink) Old 08-25-2019, 05:54 PM
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Based on the EPAS install instructions (Link) I think you are right, but I should be able to cut it down if I am not able to find a steering box with a shortened shaft that will work in the 65 - no idea if they exist or not.
The 65/66 boxes are only long shaft. The EPAS should have instructions for cutting to the right length.
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post #12 of 36 (permalink) Old 08-25-2019, 07:39 PM Thread Starter
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The 65/66 boxes are only long shaft. The EPAS should have instructions for cutting to the right length.
Here is a short shaft steering box made for the 65: Link
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post #13 of 36 (permalink) Old 08-25-2019, 07:51 PM
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All 68 69 70 Mustang, Cougar boxes are short shaft boxes.
The SMB K Box (16 to 1) will bolt exact, correct, into the 64 65 66. Same bolt pattern.
A rebuilt AMERICAN made box made by Ford is far superior to the Argentina supplied internals, and casting of box that was displayed on the prior entry.
FORD boxes are heat treated, strength of metal is far superior on rack, sector, and worm.
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post #14 of 36 (permalink) Old 08-25-2019, 08:05 PM Thread Starter
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All 68 69 70 Mustang, Cougar boxes are short shaft boxes.
The SMB K Box (16 to 1) will bolt exact, correct, into the 64 65 66. Same bolt pattern.
A rebuilt AMERICAN made box made by Ford is far superior to the Argentina supplied internals, and casting of box that was displayed on the prior entry.
FORD boxes are heat treated, strength of metal is far superior on rack, sector, and worm.
@CHOCK - Are you able to rebuild a 19:1 steering box into 16:1? If I am not concerned about being numbers correct can I order one with a core charge and send back my current? To install the EPAS I will need to cut down the 65 shaft - are you able to do that for me? - Thanks.
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post #15 of 36 (permalink) Old 08-25-2019, 08:10 PM Thread Starter
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@CHOCK - Sorry, I think I may have missed what you were trying to say. Are you saying that by getting an original SMB K Box I will be able to bolt it right into place and hook it up to the EPAS system? Thus I won't have to cut down my steering shaft while reaping the benefits of the better-built steering box...

Last edited by tjcim; 08-25-2019 at 08:22 PM.
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