What brake booster to get? - Page 2 - Vintage Mustang Forums
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post #16 of 32 (permalink) Old 09-10-2019, 02:59 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by stangtim22 View Post
What would be the point of using the booster bracket on a car with an A/T? There are no fitment issues from the Z-bar, etc.
To change the pedal ratio so you get good pedal feel with power brakes. I once owned an early '65 that was factory stock with automatic and power drums. The booster got the lever design.

On good designed power brakes you got short pedal travel, eazy pedal when braking normal and a good feel when braking hard.
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Last edited by Westmus; 09-10-2019 at 03:05 PM.
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post #17 of 32 (permalink) Old 09-10-2019, 03:05 PM
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I'm in the middle of a light resto-mod restoration myself. My car is not running so I have no point of reference, but I have never seen such a hotly debate topic as this. I read posts here on how light our cars are and the booster is totally unnecessary. And then the next few posts are guys that did it that said it was one of the top mods they've done.

I have a non power brakes car, but planned on doing power because I want my wife to feel comfortable driving it. I fully get it doesn't make the car stop any better, but she would likely say the 'drive-ability' is better and feels more like a modern car, so I'm leaning towards doing it.

But thanks to you all, I still haven't made my decision yet!

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post #18 of 32 (permalink) Old 09-10-2019, 03:21 PM
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Originally Posted by JEFFinOC View Post
.....but I have never seen such a hotly debate topic as this.
The same as power steering, some love it, others think manuel steering are much better. Also remember some people have their cars as daily drivers or sunday cruisers, while others focus more on racing. But no factory Mustang came with manual discs after '66. There are actually very few factory build street cars with manuel disc brakes. Are all the factory engineers wrong?
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post #19 of 32 (permalink) Old 09-10-2019, 04:00 PM
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Fun fact kind of related to this thread is that Hertz got so many complains about the brakes in the Shelbys that they mounted a sticker on the dash, Warning the driver that the car were equiped with racing brakes. Some of the Hertz cars came with a special Mico "2 step" MC, because Shelby tried come up with a solution that made the brakes easier handled for not race car experienced car renters. I think I read somewere that Carrolls own GT350 also got a Mico MC.
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post #20 of 32 (permalink) Old 09-10-2019, 04:51 PM
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My 65 has manual disc/drum. My wife is fine with it.

Im adding PS to the 65, wife is fine with manual steering, my rotator cuff is not.

Its not a one size fits all world we live in.


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post #21 of 32 (permalink) Old 09-10-2019, 05:33 PM
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To the original poster FYI............Check out this page.........I believe it answers the question of brake "Feel" not being right with the wrong pedal ratio as well as what you should use. I'm converting my 67 to 68 power brakes... disc and bigger rear drums.

Pedals & Boosters Identification MustangSteve.com

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post #22 of 32 (permalink) Old 09-10-2019, 06:06 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JEFFinOC View Post
I'm in the middle of a light resto-mod restoration myself. My car is not running so I have no point of reference, but I have never seen such a hotly debate topic as this. I read posts here on how light our cars are and the booster is totally unnecessary. And then the next few posts are guys that did it that said it was one of the top mods they've done.

I have a non power brakes car, but planned on doing power because I want my wife to feel comfortable driving it. I fully get it doesn't make the car stop any better, but she would likely say the 'drive-ability' is better and feels more like a modern car, so I'm leaning towards doing it.

But thanks to you all, I still haven't made my decision yet!
I have a good of respect for your point of view. Yes, it boils down to need, desirability.
I tell folks---If you have a disability you need a booster. If you have a young driver, a not used to manual brakes, not used to actually having to push on the pedal--Other than laying their foot on the pedal, You need a booster.
If you have a young 20 year old football ball playing son, You don't need a booster--He will brake the pedal off, screw it up, break it anyway---Been there!
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post #23 of 32 (permalink) Old 09-10-2019, 06:09 PM
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I bought a 6" single diaphragm brake booster from Dennis at CSRP a couple of years ago for $75 and it worked good. I have since lowered the brake pedal pin an inch and the master-brake booster 3/4" and now it is awesome! I want to touch the gas and go, touch the brakes and stop, and easily press clutch pedal and shift. Absolutely no apologies from me! I do have sciatica because of my back but I would have done the same thing either way and I'm sure it helps my track times.

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post #24 of 32 (permalink) Old 09-10-2019, 09:30 PM
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Originally Posted by Sydewaysix View Post
Interesting...do you mind elaborating on why power is a headache?
Why over complicate what is essentially a simple car?
If you want a "new" car driving experience, drive a new car....

From someone (me) who has had to "un"-screw up power brake setups....
they've just a pain in the neck on a 65/66. Too much mickey mouse.
The brake light switch, the leverage ratios, the thin firewall, the loss of
pedal feel, etc.

Drove my '66 GT this past Sunday, the first time since my cardiac surgery in
August. Stops just fine with its 4 wheel disc and antiquated FoMoCo asbestos-
based brake pads. I'm hardly a candidate for world's strongest man competition.
If it had race friction on it the car would be formidable in terms of decel-ability.


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post #25 of 32 (permalink) Old 09-10-2019, 11:51 PM Thread Starter
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Thanks for all the feedback everyone. Seems many would prefer manual brakes over power. I agree, if I want the feel and drive of a new car I’d hop into my 13 Boss but the FB will be occasionally driven by my wife (at least I’d like for her to!) so the power assist would make her feel much more comfortable. I’ll see if I can get used to it more once I get it home and start driving it around town ut I’m just trying to gather as much information now so I can prepare for the near future.

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post #26 of 32 (permalink) Old 09-11-2019, 06:18 AM
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If you need to do the booster do the Mustang Steve mod, the only way to go
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post #27 of 32 (permalink) Old 09-11-2019, 07:49 AM
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Originally Posted by GT289 View Post
Why over complicate what is essentially a simple car?
If you want a "new" car driving experience, drive a new car....
Power brakes have been the standard since the 60s and a lot of cars had them before that. Why, probably because you with a booster can make a pedal feel that most street driving people feel comfy and prefer. If you could copy that feel with manuel brakes, then the factories wouldn't use millions of $ on mounting brake boosters on all their cars.

I added power brakes and steering to my car and it still feels like an old car when driving, but it just got way more comfy for what I mostly do with my "hotrod".
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post #28 of 32 (permalink) Old 09-11-2019, 08:00 AM
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As much as I prefer my manual brakes on my '66 (disc/drum) I'm going to go out on a limb here with the OP in that he a) already has 4 wheel discs (which aren't self-energizing like drums), he probably has a 1" bore master cylinder, which provides less mechanical advantage than a 7/8" or 15/16", and has already been driving the car with manual brakes so I'm going to say "go for it" in your quest for power assist.

I'd go with something along these lines..... https://www.summitracing.com/parts/l.../model/mustang

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post #29 of 32 (permalink) Old 09-11-2019, 11:06 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Westmus View Post
Power brakes have been the standard since the 60s and a lot of cars had them before that. Why, probably because you with a booster can make a pedal feel that most street driving people feel comfy and prefer. If you could copy that feel with manuel brakes, then the factories wouldn't use millions of $ on mounting brake boosters on all their cars.
Completely erroneous as to why the OE supplies power brakes on EVERYTHING.
In reality, there are engineering specs that are fairly religiously followed for the max clutch
and brake force at the pedals. These numbers appeared on every design request when I
was at Akebono Brake.
(It has nothing to do with "feel" or modulation...... that can be best-in-class at the booster
and then be totally jacked up due to friction (pad) choice. This explains the dead pedal feeling you
get when driving some rental econo boxes...... which can be rapidly fixed by upgrading to a much
better pad)
With the whoa pedal, the OE is mainly concerned with the mass appeal of making sure EVERYBODY
can comfortably stop the car. Feel and modulation (in the US) aren't serious talking points until you
get into the really pricey platforms.

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post #30 of 32 (permalink) Old 09-11-2019, 12:57 PM
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The answer to the booster or no booster question is not as simple as selecting the right master cylinder. In general, disc brakes require considerably more fluid to be delivered to the caliper than needed by the wheel cylinders with drum brakes. This necessitates using a larger bore master cylinder or a longer pedal stroke (too long a pedal stroke can become unacceptable). A larger bore master cylinder requires more input pressure on the piston in order to operate. This is not a significant factor with just front disc brakes, one can size the master cylinder bore (usually 1") to compromise and accept a bit longer pedal travel and a bit higher pedal effort, but it becomes significant with 4 wheel disc brake. A manual brake master cylinder sized for acceptable pedal travel will require a lot of effort to depress the pedal (some say like pushing on a brick).

Putting aside the fact that I don't recommend rear disc brakes for several reasons, I'd strongly recommend power assist with a 1-1.063" master cylinder.
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