what's diff between starters for auto/manual trans - Vintage Mustang Forums
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post #1 of 24 (permalink) Old 03-12-2007, 10:38 AM Thread Starter
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I think I have the wrong starter for my 69 w/C4 trans. The partnumber (C7-#####-F) on the starter I have tells me that it went on a car with a manual trans, but I need one for a C4. Its never been installed on my car before so I'm not usre if it will work. How can I tell the difference between a starter from a manual transmission and an automatic transmission ? pics might help.

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post #2 of 24 (permalink) Old 03-12-2007, 11:51 AM
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If I recall correctly I've used both starters on my toploader. I'm sure someone will know for sure, I just can't remember if they are the same or not.
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post #3 of 24 (permalink) Old 03-12-2007, 12:12 PM
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IIRC? You can use a automatic starter in a manual trans but you cant use a manual one in a automatic trans because the nose is longer.
Hopefully someone will chime in and let us know if im correct about this cause its been awhile and kinda curious as well.


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post #4 of 24 (permalink) Old 03-12-2007, 01:00 PM
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The starter gear offset is the difference (amount the gear protrudes from the mounting flange).

Automatics are 3/4"
Manual (except T5) are 3/8"

The hole that the nose sticks into in the block plate is also sized differently.

Auto = 4.09"
Manual = 4.14"

I just finished making a 3/8" thick adapter/spacer to alow the use of an auto starter on a 4spd, but you can't do it the other way around to my knowledge.
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post #5 of 24 (permalink) Old 03-12-2007, 02:14 PM
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IIRC there is or was a screw up in the auto-part store computers that caused people to get the wrong starter at times.

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post #6 of 24 (permalink) Old 03-12-2007, 06:28 PM
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You can't fit a real automatic starter in a manual; it won't go in far enough. Most of the parts catalogs have the auto and manual starters reversed. How do I know? I went to a manufacturer of starters, and got both versions. The "automatic" fit my manual car, but the "manual" did not. I returned the one unit that did not fit. The part number that did work was 3153 from Precision CeriPro Warehouse in Chantilla, VA. Autozone lists the manual version as 3152.

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post #7 of 24 (permalink) Old 03-12-2007, 07:48 PM
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i removed a 1965 c4 and bell,installed a late model manual bell and new t5z manual 5 speed and reused my old c4 starter , without any problems.
so the later model bell is deeper , at that starter area , than old manual bell....
i ***-u-me ?

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post #8 of 24 (permalink) Old 03-12-2007, 08:44 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Midlife
You can't fit a real automatic starter in a manual; it won't go in far enough. Most of the parts catalogs have the auto and manual starters reversed. How do I know? I went to a manufacturer of starters, and got both versions. The "automatic" fit my manual car, but the "manual" did not. I returned the one unit that did not fit. The part number that did work was 3153 from Precision CeriPro Warehouse in Chantilla, VA. Autozone lists the manual version as 3152.
i think that was my case. So maybe it wasn't a "senior moment"
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post #9 of 24 (permalink) Old 03-12-2007, 09:53 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wayne50f1
i removed a 1965 c4 and bell,installed a late model manual bell and new t5z manual 5 speed and reused my old c4 starter , without any problems.
so the later model bell is deeper , at that starter area , than old manual bell....
i ***-u-me ?
The T5Z manual and flywheel may have been the difference...

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post #10 of 24 (permalink) Old 03-13-2007, 09:13 AM
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I used the same starter from my original 3 Speed for the C4 and eventually for the T5 and never had a problem.

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post #11 of 24 (permalink) Old 11-21-2018, 07:06 PM
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This might clear things up a bit.

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post #12 of 24 (permalink) Old 11-21-2018, 07:20 PM
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Talking Starters

Quote:
Originally Posted by Midlife View Post
You can't fit a real automatic starter in a manual; it won't go in far enough. Most of the parts catalogs have the auto and manual starters reversed. How do I know? I went to a manufacturer of starters, and got both versions. The "automatic" fit my manual car, but the "manual" did not. I returned the one unit that did not fit. The part number that did work was 3153 from Precision CeriPro Warehouse in Chantilla, VA. Autozone lists the manual version as 3152.
And here I always thought I had it backwards. When I had my shop, we got starters from Bennett Auto. We had to order the opposite for every starter, so now I know it wasn't just us with this problem!

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post #13 of 24 (permalink) Old 11-21-2018, 08:06 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JohnZ View Post
IIRC there is or was a screw up in the auto-part store computers that caused people to get the wrong starter at times.
This is still true, but it applies to 65 Mustangs. Two different flywheels were used on 4 speed cars in 65. Some use the starter listed for Manuals, some use the starter listed for Automatics.

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post #14 of 24 (permalink) Old 11-21-2018, 08:12 PM
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Wow, what an old thread. Wasn't there a recent one about starters? IE, not from 11 years ago?
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post #15 of 24 (permalink) Old 11-21-2018, 08:26 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GypsyR View Post
Wow, what an old thread. Wasn't there a recent one about starters? IE, not from 11 years ago?

Holy thread revival Batman! An 11 year old thread revived today.


Here's the answer, plain and simple.
If you have a 157T flywheel or 157T flexplate you need the so called "automatic" starter with the long snout and exposed drive gear.
If you have a 164T flywheel or 164T flexplate you need the so called "manual" starter with the short snout and the recessed drive gear.



There used to be a diagram with the difference in the location of the ring gear between the 2 different tooth count flywheels/flexplates explained on a Bronco forum.


When is this website going to have "stickies" so we don't have to explain this every time the question comes up.


Here it is. I hope it shows up.
https://imgur.com/a/BurQ2

Last edited by awhtx; 11-21-2018 at 08:32 PM.
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